quran says allah is the best in makar

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yashwant.IITR

quran says allah is the best in makar

misbahul-loghat

publisher=mukammil arabi urdu dictionary;

abul fazal abdul hafeez baliyavi

maktaba burhan urdu bazaar jama masjid dehli

ustad, nadvatul muslimeen ulama, lucknow

sabik ustad, deoband

pp 832

ist column

last word

makar=makara;makaran;ar rujula wabihi;dhokha dena;

2nd column,2nd word

makarahu=fareb dena

amkarahu=dhokha dena - allah(dwara) makar ki saza dena

quran

sura imran ayat 54

And they (disbelievers) plotted [to kill 'Iesa (Jesus)], and Allah planned too. And Allah is the Best of the
planners(makar).
anfal ayat 30

And (O beloved Prophet)! Remember, when the infidels were plotting against you, to confine you or to
slay you or to drive you forth. And they were

plotting their own and Allah was devising His Own and Allah's devise is the best.

the muslim ulema of deoband and nadvatul fame translate the quality of makar possessed by allah as

dhokha, fareb , etc

The english translations use the word plotter , planner (against human machinations)

I, FOR ONE, WILL NEVER SUBMIT TO A FALSE GOD WHO IS A DHOKHA BAAZ , DAGA BAAZ , FAREBI. He
WHO PLOTS AGAINST HIS OWN CREATION---MANKIND . THEN, WHAT IS WRONG (i.e. this too is
wrong)WITH INDRA SENDING MANEKA TO VISHWAMITRA ?

Those who want to do so are free .

Those who want to believe that mohammed could cleave the moon into 2 by the movement of a finger
and aspire for a dar ul islam in the world are free to pursue their day dreams .

Those who want to believe in the belief of Mohammed in the 21st century ; that meteors and comets
are thrown by angels towards jinns are free to do so .

[The snatching of the heavenly news by the jinn is referred to in several places in the

Quran. The interested reader may look up the S uras Hijr (15:16-18), Saffat (37:7-10),Mulk (67:5), and
Jinn (72:8-10).sahih hadith (5538)]

Truth (VEDAS) is evident from falsehood (QURAN).

ALI [http://www.orkut.co.in/Main#Profile.aspx?uid=12959227717624277063]

@YASHWANTH
53. Our Lord! We believe in what You have sent down, and we follow the Messenger ['Iesa (Jesus)]; so
write us down among those who bear witness (to the truth i.e. La ilaha ill-Allah - none has the right to be
worshipped but Allah).

54. And they (disbelievers) plotted [to kill 'Iesa (Jesus)], and Allah planned too. And Allah is the Best of
the planners.

55. And (remember) when Allah said: "O 'Iesa (Jesus)! I will take you and raise you to Myself and clear
you [of the forged statement that 'Iesa (Jesus) is Allah's son] of those who disbelieve, and I will make
those who follow you (Monotheists, who worship none but Allah) superior to those who disbelieve [in
the Oneness of Allah, or disbelieve in some of His Messengers, e.g. Muhammad , 'Iesa (Jesus), Musa
(Moses), etc., or in His Holy Books, e.g. the Taurat (Torah), the Injeel (Gospel), the Qur'an] till the Day of
Resurrection. Then you will return to Me and I will judge between you in the matters in which you used
to dispute."

56. "As to those who disbelieve, I will punish them with a severe torment in this world and in the
Hereafter, and they will have no helpers."

Well as i see you are an IITian, I expect you to possess good deal of understanding. As stated above Allah
has planned to help the believers from the one who disbelieve.

And there is no point in you being doubtful or angry or confront GOD the AlMighty as HE is the best of
planners.

and ALLAH is trying to help the believers from the disbelievers. Im sure you would agree this.

Well regarding deobandis as you might not have knowledge abt them are a bunch of idiotic deviated
people away from the actual beliefs of Islam and hence I request you not to consider what they write.

The english translations use the word plotter, planner (against human machinations)

Now what do you mean by this my dear IIT bro...cuz as your scriptures say as far as i remember...

1. Rama had killed Vali from behind....

2. Krishna enlightens Arjuna when Arjuna says that he cannot fight Kauravas cuz
they are his cousins and Krishna tells him that he is born Kshatriya n is born to

fight and must fight for the cause of good to kill the evil and in the process if you

die then you will attain heaven...not the xact words...almost sth like this....

there are hell lot of stories from YOUR SCRIPTURES....isnt it...

Now you dont seem to have any problem with those..for example say kouravas were MANKIND too....

I also happen to see a movie in which krishna takes bheema to some king who was immortal (i dont
remember clearly not immortal but never b defeated i think)... Bheema and that king fight with each
other...bheema tears that king apart(up to down) n throws the otehr half to one side....then again that
body gets attached and starts to fight again...this happens several times...then KRISHNA slowly suggests
bheema to take one half of the body and asks him to throw it to the opposite side so that it cannot
attach again...then bheema does the same...n that king dies....

NW YOU WILL SAY THAT IT WAS FOR JUSTICE....THATS THE SAME THING BRO...WAT SURAH IMRAN WAS
REFERRING TO...which ur IITan mind cudnt get it....

seee even though u hav these many related things in UR SCRIPTURE...u still come n do this bullshit
talking about THE ALMIGHTY....

well I have the basic commonsense to understand that wat Rama, Krishna...r who ever it is did it for
justice....but ur IITan brain cudnt get it....

Truth (VEDAS) is evident from falsehood (QURAN)

have you ever read Quran with understanding...atleast have you ever read the vedas with
understanding....i know u didnt, i know you r not allowed to./..unless ur a bhramin...see the
differentiation has started here..which unfortunately u will not agree....

WHAT IS WRONG WITH INDRA SENDING MANEKA TO VISHWAMITRA ?

comon r u out of ur mind lol...do u know why Indra sent Menaka...to distract Muni Vishwamita from his
Tapasya....why??do u knw that...try to distract him...i dont want to get into these things or use any foul
language wat so ever....

and by the way wat kinda analogy do u do...comon...if u really feel wat ur following is right then why
compare it with others...n the way u compare...u look like a poor boy...then wat is wrong with indra... as
if u meant....ur God did a mistake so did ours.....Go get a life dude...

Assalamu alaikum.....

yashwant.IITR

hmmm...

ALLAH is trying to help the believers from the disbelievers. I m sure you would agree this.

no, I don't!

allah is creating 2 sets of people . one who believe in islam and others .

allah will fill zannat with muslims and jahannum with others .

allah ensured that all the people will not embrace islam .otherwise jahannum will be empty!

who is to blame for crimes like rape and murder ?

man or allah ?

if everything happens according to allah's will , then allah is to blame .

if not, then what is 'allah ki marzi?

AUM [the formless one and only god]allows people to act freely.

In sanskrit atma is karta or one who is free to act .

but the karta is bound by reward/punishment.

ALI

I really wonder what Hinduism tells about these things...

who is to blame for rape n murder??

u do have a concept of heave n hell right???

Allah Almighty knows every thing that has happened, that is happening, that will happen......

If HE wills, anything can r shd I say WILL happen.....

but HE will not force things to happen.....HE has left it to our choice....

it is our deeds and our intentions that makes us to behave good r bad....i dont think ur stupid enough to
blame rape n murders done by us to ALMIGHTY.....n dont argue just u have to plz...

well regarding deobandis or any sect or any person wat so ever....a true believer is the one who believes
in ONE FORMLESS GOD...acts according to Quran n Sunnah of Prophet Mohammad(pbuh)....n these
deobandis are the deviated ones...

to give u an example of why they are deviated ones....the deobandis beleive that GOD can tell a
lie....nw im sure even u wudnt agree with that....

AUM [the formless one and only god]allows people to act freely.

In sanskrit atma is karta or one who is free to act .

but the karta is bound by reward/punishment.

n by the way wat is this???the formless one and only god...do u really believe in that???? thats
cool....havent u got pictures or statues of GOD?? dont u believe in them???...well if yes, i really
appreciate it...

Well I would also like to add a point...

How come people believe that GOD is formless and at the same time pray to demi Gods, have their
statues created to pray???

Well as the logic says...it could either be formless or with form...but not both...plz explain...

Sanaul

Yashwant..

Have you understood the context written in Surah 3:54..

Allah is the best of planners that means if you/we (nauzobillah) will plan to break the commandment of
Almighty GOD then Almighty GOD will also plan to save the commandments because Almighty GOD
alone is the master of all universe..That verse basically was revealed to show man kind that "Oh man
kind, dont try to be oversmart in front of Almighty GOD, he knows everything and he can judge your all
moves and motives, if you will plan against his commandments then he will not let you to roam free
with expanded chest, when he will plan against you you can not save yourself for sure"..and in every
religion GOD is telling this atleast to the followers..prove that in Hinduism this has not been said by
GOD..If you beleive in Bhagwat Geeta then Krishna himself said this to the man kind..If you are tana tan
Arya Samaji (Hail Hitler) then many Hindus here themselves will correct you..Any more stuffs to be
discussed, please put here..

Karthik

Form in Vedas

Rig Veda

http://sacred-texts.com/hin/rigveda/rv01043.htm

To Rudra Lord of sacrifice, of hymns and balmy medicines,

mischievous..~~

An illustrative example for the concept

That's exactly the reason y Muslims deny the form of God ... Mainly coz , each one has his / her
imagination of God ... That's not how it's supposed to be ... No offense ...
This is wt is being said abt God .... accordin to Islam ...

Ali , The fourth Khalifa , is reported to have said: "He is being but not through the phenomenon of
coming into being. He exists but not from non-existence. He is with everything but not physical
nearness. He is different from everything but not by physical separation. He acts but without the
accompaniment of movements and instruments. He is the One, only such that there is none with
whom He keeps company or whom He misses in his absence."

According to Islam , characterizin God in any human form or depictin Him as favorin certain individuals
or nations or blah blah is not allowed ... which means ... God is known by His names n attributions ....

Saleel

Brother Yashwant,

Translation of Al-Imran, verse 54:

YUSUFALI: And (the unbelievers) plotted and planned, and Allah too planned, and the best of planners is
Allah.

PICKTHAL: And they (the disbelievers) schemed, and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best
of schemers.

SHAKIR: And they planned and Allah (also) planned, and Allah is the best of planners.

Translation of Al-Anfal, verse 30 :

YUSUFALI: Remember how the Unbelievers plotted against thee, to keep thee in bonds, or slay thee, or
get thee out (of thy home). They plot and plan, and Allah too plans; but the best of planners is Allah.

PICKTHAL: And when those who disbelieve plot against thee (O Muhammad) to wound thee fatally, or to
kill thee or to drive thee forth; they plot, but Allah (also) plotteth; and Allah is the best of plotters.

SHAKIR: And when those who disbelieved devised plans against you that they might confine you or slay
you or drive you away; and they devised plans and Allah too had arranged a plan; and Allah is the best of
planners.
The above are three of the most renowned translations of the holy Qur'an. In both instances, the
translations convey the meaning that Allah's plans defeated the evil machinations of the unbelievers.
There is no mention of CHEATING

The following is the link of a concise Arabic-English dictionary of Qur'anic terms. You can find "yamkuru"
(the present form of the root verb "makara") translated as "to plot" listed on the bottom left of the first
page.

http://www.emuslim.com/Quran/English80/eng_80_part_2.pdf

You could find the full dictionary here if interested :

http://www.emuslim.com/Quran/Dictionary_English.asp

Thanks and peace...

yashwant.IITR

google translation of 'to plot '

to plot [english]= saazish karne ke liye [hindi]

Ashraf

@Mr IIT xyz

i think you need an explain is hindi.

verse meaning is this way.

"aye nabi(pbuh)- islam ke dushman islam ke virodh chal pe chal chalejarahe he, par aap yadrake ki
bahtareen chaal chal ne walah allah he"
so the foolish enemies islam would ultimately gain nothing.

its simple as such and muslim scholar have debate and applied thought on verse of quran since
centuries. fortunately islam is not a blind faith where you dont question faith and follow your parent's
belief.

ALI

@yashwanth

ur an IITian my dear and cant u even understand this simple logic...

see no offence and i apologize if u dont like it....but to get this one straight into ur mind, i have to use
this analogy...

suppose someone tries to rob ur house...r do sth that is brutal to u and ur family..

wat wud u do???? wud u shut up??? wud u just see the oppressors, give a smiling face n let them go
away...wud u???

obviously any human in this world wudnt do that.....hell yes even u will not do it....

one wud kick their a**es in a way they can...

or

go to the police n get justice.....

NW coming to justice....wat do u expect them to do????do u expect the justice to leave them??? hell
nooo....
thats the same thing here....it is the system of a country that we were discussing...n that is the system of
GOD....n if u dont really like the system of GOD...then U SHOULD BE AN ATHEIST WHO IS A FOOL,
TRYING TO FOOL NONE BUT HIMSELF....

cuz...when u dont like justice done by GOD then u shdnt like justice done by ur gods tooo.....I already
told u instances in ur religion, where it was mandatory to fightt for good cause.....n ur gods told that it is
fair to do so....dont u agree with that???

so wat I tell u is to shut up..stop blaming otehrs...go to ur scriptures...go thoroughly thru them....do a
comparative study of other scriptures...then come here n start a dialogue...

Saleel

Brother Yashwant,

It was nice to see your rhetoric being toned down from calling Allah a "cheater" and "liar" (naoodubillah)
in the thread "OPEN CHALLENGE TO ZAKIR NAIK" to calling him a "Plotter".

Dear brother, plots can be good or evil. Both the above verses talk of evil plots being hatched by
unbelievers against Allah's messengers. But ultimately, no matter how much they plan and plot, all their
efforts are in vain in comparison to the Universal Plan of Allah, which would ensure that truth triumphs
over falsehood. It would be naive to say that Allah would have to spend time and effort countering the
plots of the evil ones. The holy Qur'an clearly says that Allah is the All-knowing, the Wise [24:18, 49:8
etc.]. Further :

"With Him are the keys of the unseen, the treasures that none knoweth but He. He knoweth whatever
there is on the earth and in the sea. Not a leaf doth fall but with His knowledge: there is not a grain in
the darkness (or depths) of the earth, nor anything fresh or dry (green or withered), but is (inscribed) in
a record clear." [6:59]

Allah knows even our secret thoughts [67:13, 57:6 etc.]. It would be foolish to assume that any
acts/plots of His creatures could frustrate Him.
"Nor is Allah to be frustrated by anything whatever in the heavens or on earth: for He is All-Knowing. All-
Powerful."

====

To clarify further, let me quote Yusuf Ali's footnote to verse 3:54 discussed earlier :

"The word "Makara" has both a bad and a good meaning, that of making an intricate plan to carry out
some secret purpose. The enemies of Allah are constantly doing that. But Allah - in whose hands is all
good - has His plans also, against which the evil ones will have no chance whatever."

====

Brother Yashwant, already many members have explained the verses clearly. I think it is time to
conclude and move on to other topics.

ALI

@ Yashwanth

Well Mr. IITian seems like we've got a very patient n forgiving Moderator(Br Saleel. n I want to let him
know that I have got a lot of respect for him)

Had I been one of the moderators I would have asked u whether u'r MAN enough

to accept that wat u were blaming was absolutely wrong (as it is clearly evident

here)....
or

to go with ur theory(which is clearly evident here that it is proved wrong) n make a

fool of urself...

may God ALmighty show all of us the straight path....

ALI

@Defender

Beautifully said,but slim chances it will enter thick skulls.

I didnt give a reply nor did I counter it because it was out of respect for karthik...because i asked him
only to get the information...it was nothin like a dialogue thing....

n by the way for ur kind information let me give u one simple thing...

how could it be God with a form and without a form???

it shd either b one of them...

God with no form is mentioned in Vedas...

u ppl follow the God with form...

either wat u follow or the vedas is wrong...

nw which standpoint wud u take....

if anyone is offended....i apologize..that is not my intention...

yashwant.IITR

hmmm...

Brother Yashwant, already many members have explained the verses clearly. I think it is time to
conclude and move on to other topics.

yes

to u allah

and to me AUM

(arya samaj mandir does not have idols, we believe in caste by merit, sati is not practised here , dowry is
not upheld in vedas , we convert other religion folks , we believe in punarjanm,etc this is for ALI)

topic

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