\\

SENSING,
FEELING,
AND
"ONE OF THE THINGS THAT
I THINK IS ESSENTIAL WITH
SENSING, IS THAT WE REACH
A POINT WHERE WE BECOME
CONSCIOUS AND THEN WE
LET IT GO, SO THAT THE
SENSING ITSELF IS NOT A
MOTIVATION; THAT OUR
MOTIVATION IS ACTION,
BASED ON PERCEPTION."
,,,,"'isl,,"/ ill CQ 6:2. Winter IlJSL
INTERVIEW WITH BONNIE BAINBRIDGE COHEN
by Nancy Stark Smith for CQ
Tht: following ;,zteniew took place in Northampton. Mass., Oil November 26, 1980.
CQ: You t,llk of 'embodiment' Dften
in your work. CDuld you say some-
tbing about it?
Be: A good example is a newborn in-
fant. Their hand goes across their face
and at first there is only a momentary
recognition of something going across
their eyes. After awhile, as they devel-
op a little further, the hand will go a-
cross their eyes and they'll follow it,
but there's not the recognition that
it's their hand yet. One day, they fol-
low it and they turn their head, and
they move their hand back and they
turn their head back and you see
something in their eres when they
start really manipulating the hand.
Another sense opens up that this hand
is me. And then comes the play be-
tween the two hands, and the play of
the hands and the eyes.
Embodiment is, in a wa}'. separat-
ing out. It's feeling the force that is
in this body. But in order to embody
ourselves, we need to know what is .
not ourselves. It's a relationship. A
child that only embodies its hand, for
instance, might be tonsidered autistic.
(f it's carried too far there's self-ab-
sorption; there's a certain awareness
that this is me, but not an awareness
that you're you. If it's just about
what's me and not what's no't me,
then I don't think it works; there's no
counterbalance, no definition. What
I would call balanced embodiment
would include, 'This is the end of me;
this is the beginning of something else.'
11
63
/""
nextstagewillbemo(emind-
based,ratherthanbody-based. Both
:1
!, willbe there,butjustas the mind is
"IT'SDIFFERENTIFYOUSENSESOMETHING,THANIF \' in thebodyarea now,thebody will
YOUFEELIT,THANIFYOUSIMPLYDOIT."
\.' beinthemindarea.
CQ: What do you mean by 'mind-
based'?
CQI WhRt's the difference between 'BC: If we didn'tinhibitanynatural"'-'.
Be: Each individualgoesintoanarea .-'\
the traditional way oflearning/teach- i( functioning,thereprobablywouldn't ): ofstudywitha certainmind,andwe
ing anatomy and the process of em- beanyneed. Infact,youseethat !; usuallykeepthesamemindthrough-
bodying it? peoplewhodon'thavealotofprob- outallofourexplorations. WhatI'm
,.. Jems, whoarefairly wellintegrated
doingnowis tryingtohelppeople
Be: Generally,whenanatomyis ,! (don'tspendtheirtimeonintegrating;Ii recognizethemindthatthey'reap-
taughtasIlearnedit, :u 1se;it'\ \theyspend timejnsome.action.f! proachingsomethingwith,ascom-
youregtyenVlSUa! 'yf.{ostofusm thISworkcomemtoit \, paredto (themindof] thematerial
pIcturesofIt. WehaveanwageofIt,. ,''-'becausewehaveproblems;we'rein-'\' itself. Forexample,somepeople
butwedon'thavethekinesthesiaof " : hibitedinsomewaythatpreventsus ' " mightfeel thingsmorethroughthe
;
itwithinourselves. Maybewe'll even! '. fromfunctioningthewaywefeel we bones,anotherpersonmorethrough
say,'Oh,Ihavethisboneorthismus--<,'shouldbeableto. By becomingcon- themuscles,somesay they'remore
dein me,'butit'sanintellectualcon- sciousoftheprocesses,weeliminate intothesenses. It'sdifferentifyou
cept,' ratherthantheinformationcom- ourunconsciousinhibitions,andcan sensesomething,thanifyoufeel it,
ingthroughviscerallyfromthepropri- functionnormally. Oncewehavere- )'anifyousimplydoit. Sensingis
oceptorsofthatthingitself. Thein- movedtheobstaclesandarefunction- lblatedto eke neQTQUS 6i)'6ti8H\Ult.QQgh
formationisalWRYS cominginvisceral- ingefficiently,there'snoneedtokeep theperceptions; Feeling. are
ly,buteachpersonisselectiveinterms lookingforobstacles. It'snotthat ! related tothefltritt-system-iMluding
ofwhattheychoosetoacknow1edge. ,we'renevergoingtoneedtobeaware \thecircuiatory,iymlSh'll:ticllndeere
Thestudyingthatwe'redoingatthe I again,buttherearemomentswhenwe '6@"".spiilaIlltiiGs. By approaching
school [SchoolforBody/MindCen- \ canbecomewhoUy active', andnot ,everythingwiththesamemind,you
?/ ' tering] ishighlyselectiveintermsof 'hl!-Y'e tomonitorouractivity. areconstantlyinitiatingactivityfrom
receivinginput;wegofromonesys- - ..,.'-.. thesameplace. Forexample,1 think
temtotheother-nowwe'regoing CQI Another benefit ofthis kind of thatalotofpeopleintheContact
'. intothesenses,nowwe'regoingto work would be that you could per- workareworkingwithsensing-sen-
acknowledge the information from cewe and deal with subtle imbalances
singwheretheyare,feeling weights;
theskeleton,nowfromtheeye,now before they become major problems.
they'reusingtheirperceptualsystems
from themuscles,nowfrom theor-
toinitiatefrom,inparticularthe
fromtheglands, thebrain,the BC: Certainlyitleadstoawareness;
weightperceptorsandthemovement
blood,etc. By acknowledgingeach itis awareness. ButI alsoseethat
,perceptors. Butthere'safunny thillg
, whenyoudothat. Thefluidsarea
one, weseethattheyarechannels oftenwe,in thiswork,concentrate
thatcanbeacknowledgedbychoice. somuchonthejugglingofsystems,
counterbalancetotheperceptions or
Oncethey'vebeenacknowledged whateverwehappentobestudying,
th.e nervoussyStem. Soifthepercep-
tuaJ:systemu-always.initi,atingorbe-
consciously, we canutilizethatin- thatweendupbeingsickalotof
ingthemover,thenthefluids areal-
... formationwithoutit remainingpri- , thetime. [thinkithastodowith "
. .wayshavingtobethesupport. There
r
mary. OneofthethingsthatI think'" somepartofus identifyingwith the
becomesatimewhenyouwanttore-
isessential withsensing,is thatwe systemortheimbalance thatwe're
, verse thatbalance,whenyouwant '
: 'reach.apointwherewebecomecon- studying. Soinfactwegofromone
theperceptionstogoquiet,tobe-
'" sciousandthenweletitgo,sothat ' 'imbalancedstatetoanother.
comethesupport,andletthefluids
\ 'thesensingitselfis notamotivation;.:' ly we becomemore well orpotential-
,,_ , (thatourmotivationis action,pased ly wellbybalancingallthesediffer-
becomethemover. That'swhen you
go intosimplymoving,withoutsen-
entthings,butwhatI'mexploring
- singanymore,trustingthatthesenses
nowis howwe cancome tosome
ception,weforgetabouttheaction. wholeimage,awholestateofmind ,
havegoneunconsciousand willsup-
Theperceptionbecomesthekey thatwe wouldidentifywith.".Then/
portyouwithoutthembeingcon-
thing: whatamI perceiving. Instead explorationofeachsystem!'{OIild
scious. When I sayforgettingthem,
ofeating, whatbecomesimportant be a-study, biu:-wewouldn't-atfach
1meanlettingthemgounconscious
is: howdoesittaste, whatis thetex- ourbasicselfwith thestudy. Then
andlettingthefluids becomethecon-
ture. Insteadofjustwalkingit's: Ithinkwe couldbecomeaware ot,
trol.
howam Iwalking,whatfoot'sgoing theimbalanceswithoutbecomingiiL
Takeaverylargegroup ofpeople,
infrontoftheother,howarethe
havethemmoveinaverysmallspace
bonesfalling. All ofthatis impor- CQ: How do you see the 'who/e andhavethemmove sensing'.They'll
tant,butthereis atimetojustsimply
image' evolving? slowup;whenpeoplesense, there's
....... orsimplyeatfornourishment. thisslowingupofthefluids. Then
Be: Isee.ourworkgoingintoatran- havethemdrop thatandmovevery
CQ: Then what is the value of em-
sitionin thenextcouple ofyears. It quicklyin atightgroup with nosen-
bodying? Ifyou Fan walk anyway,
willgointoanotherkindofappr-Qach sing. Whatyou'IIfindis thatyou're
then wby bother knowing how it
thatwill have an overviewbased on saferunderfastmovementwith no
feels in such detail, OT getting so in-
whatwe'vegainedfrom havinggone sensingthanyouareundertheslow
volved witb it?
ratherinnocentlyintoeach system., sensing. Howeverwe'vedeveloped,
64 SENSING, FEELING. AND ACTION
12
,." me;ebest,iliOrt iUtolfikdeatt"
aHa.8''i.a',all, ..hen we-IlICWt
quicJd:..withfluidity..._...tite
"'_. aiDa; jotSnrCOIIIQlliUl a.' the fh!t'ds
.?tako.. . tbanBOP'iH
./ l R'uwuLewl,. wi:!!h Ithappens
overandoveragain. Peoplearesur-
prisedthattheyfeelsaferunderthis
fastmovingthanwhenthey aresen-
singwhereeachpersonis. Andthey're
lesslikely tobumpintosomebody
andhaveanaccident. Nowifyou
takeagroupofpeoplewhohavenev-
ersensed,andhave themrunning
quickly, they'dprobablybebumping
intoeachotherall thetime. They'd
berunningintoeach otherbecause
theydon'tknowwheretheyare.
. ":-'"1CQ: SOyou're using the senses as a
i support for the fluids and if the
have never been developed they can t
be a wrystable support?
BC: Thenthefluidshaveneverbeen
asupportforthesenses. It'sabalance.
It'snottochooseoneovertheother
buttohavethisbalance. We havea
tendencytogetone-sided.
CQ: You said something about
sing, feeling, and doing'. What's the
difference lIetween sensing and feel-
ing? WoN","'6 me pel"om?
BC: Theftcrids.If>,outre
natsuchaa'lIutiM1ei
you!te.jul...,the1t-ym.pthe-emo-
Alotofthesensingworkisan
escapefrom theemotions. itactually
repressesemotionalintegrationifit's
, notb3.Ianced. Personally,havingbeen
so chaoticallyemotionalatonepoint,
likelavajustflowingoneway and
thentheother,notabletohandleit,
Ifoundsensingwasahaven from that.
Andaway togetinsight.
the'tAl'llwegetinsiBlM. BattJieft
on.;: .aad.dlat
becamc:.an.imbaJaa.r;e, Becauseofthe
workI'ininand thesensitivityofmy
systems,Icanswingvetyfarfrom one
endtotheother,it'snotminorchan-
ges. SoI gotintoalotoffluid prob-
lems. Thenhadtogo backintothe
fluidswhichwasfqrmegoingbackin-
totheemotions. Butwithinsight as
abalance,as asupportingstructure.
CQ: Are the senses able to function
more easily as a support for the fluids
in a familiar envi1'onment rather than
in unpredictable surroundings?
BC: ,Wired:t0U'ltiiitmfamilmsur-
roundingstirefirsnhiIlg,ott ltbis

nOM 88M'eli"latIipeift'"hcze1IN
dQU', kD$Wwlretthe You
retardthefluids inordertobeonthe
alert. Butifyou'rein anactualmo-
mentofdanger,ifyoustoptoolong
toperceiveit,you'llbeexterminated,
you'lldie. Yousimply mustactand
atthatpointtheperceptionsgoun-
conscious. Hopefullyyou'vegained
enough perceptualabilityas asupport
thatyoucansurvive.
CQ: It's a beautiful distinction
making bet'Ween the fluids being tbe
flO'W, the action, and the brain and
nervous system being the perceptions,
the senses. Contact Improvisation is
interesting in this reSpect because it
seems that you're called upon to act
asyou'1"e sensing.
.,
BC: That'swhenits themostbeauti-
ful. Intermsof'Watching Contact,
itgetslongandtediousunlessyou
havethesemomentswheresomeone
breaksoutandthat'swhenyoufInd
yourgoodcontacters. Yoasee t!tJellfl.
breHe_.,en_tllalld
areacting: It'sveryexcitingandyou
getarushfromwatchingitandI'm
sureyougetarush fromdoingit.
Youonlyseeitwithpeoplewhofeel
secure,who'vesensedenough toknow
they canletthesensesgo. Certainly,
ifyougetmeoutthere,inthebegin-
ningthere'snoway I'mjustgoingto
respondbecauseIdon'tknowhow
torespond. I'mgoingtogovery
slowlyandI'mgoingtowanttofeel
everylittlepartof mybodyand
whereitisandthenatsomepoint
I'lljustgoandro)) withit. There's
noholdingback.
"ALOTOFSENSINGWORK
IS AN ESCAPEFROMTHE
EMOTIONS,ITACTUALLY
REPRESSESEMOTIONAL
INTEGRATIONIFIT'SNOT
BALANCED,"
CQ: At that point you'd be flipping
from sensing to acting? from
nerr10US system to fluids?
Be: Thingsarenotseesaw-like,with
oneendhereandoneendthere.
WInrt'impptMI;tlletl>'00go ill'S.'R-

respiration,becltl'l5e you'reietltftHfig
IIlefttrtdf. noilApWtllaec0. the
bIcoe
alhlte-'e'ellS"itn'ltttkitigi."nft1:tte'\iVattes.
it'S'basicallyaboutoxygen,whichis
breathing. Sohereyouhaveanother
systemcomingin,respiration,tobe
studyinginrelationtotheblood. All
13
ofI:suddellSOIhofi?WiIt
bteatililld1"U1m"wtlre''fluids>.Jmre
IiI!'Ett rt!ft!i!!ft. !II efttl'ttt!l'art''ffiem-
Ulna!lapiIaEiol1as ex...
temalrespiratien;1:he-llir;>Wbiclrwe
-nermaHytbit1kttf'lS'breathing: The
b'1
.
CQ: Often in doing sensing 'Work,
gt'a'Dity and relaxation 'Work, at e.ach
let1el ofrelaxation a deep breath 'Will
come, a release ofsome sort. I''De
'Wondered 'What that was about.
BC: Bysensing,wereleasetherestric-
tion,whetherit'smuscularorwhat-
ever,whichreleasestheblood. The
brea.thfollows. Whenyoufeel that
deep breath,somethinghasbeenre-
patternedintothenervoussystem.
CQ: Do you feel that in 'Working
with one area, such as the eye, that
you are also 'Working directly with
each ofthe otber systems?
BC, I'mtryingtodothatwiththe
visionclass 9CimhilltlcAteMat'1md
llld5C!llaE " SWillef.,IttiUt 81t...
VCiHl ."SI_,.eec. Wedoalotofper-
ceptualwork,butwhatI'vebeentry-
ingtobringoutis thatvllft'Jn iIt_.
thilrtlTtt'r-IDSfT1OW'tfie
oped.. It was totde.el""ed C<J bep..
i!
elM;it 11Iwo,aft4(-
,
Dan.. Ithasdevdoped'6."acEi;e.
1
PCiccl'ft6n, ;;huw'!;cllche,lI.,an
aetiOIlf'M11M
perceiving-oHteet{. Thoseofuswith
visualproblemscan,bysensing,be-
comeawareof,say,which muscles
arepUllinga certainway.Thatinfor-
mationbecomespartofourrepertoire.
Itcangointoourunconscious. But
whenyougotolook,don'ttryto
moveyourmuscleoryourbones,but
lettheeyerespondtothelightthat's
beingreflected. We even trytoper-
ceivelight; howdoyouperceive light,
howdoyoubecomereceptivetothat
phenomenon? Onceyoubecomere-
ceptivetothatphenomenon, of
thereceptionasyourmoverOrasyour
$
purposeandletthatbecomethesup-
1
l
port forseeing. .
'EvtdatiOl!lUity, tile-,isual.,..tem

eeptel',.hD'rll'rtHeS. Aridifevery-
thingwasworkingwell,thereprobab-
lywouldn'tbeanyneedforsuchself-
consciousness. However,W'e"Ir.lve
bef!'eSiuslll'u,bleiilS;'lha+dielbiltty
Il8 per.ccivcHbem, whimofeetsusthe
OppOIcauh:y 'felf- "4-
oenscmSlNss'mto'ftllfltl'lewledge.
..
BnUdWQt!tj'itjgg(QIIJ;Cr
I
b-.I"'*'a::iRnePJf leeking,rids
transfonuetidftt:iil!Mftllt!'place.Q-
Sensing, Feeling, andAction
65