Você está na página 1de 14

am sorry if you feel that way. and you maybe right i don't know.

however, skipping my articles is your prerogative. so don’t worry about it.

in the end, the loss maybe yours not mine.

more importantly, please notice that the confusion YOU WERE


COMPLAINING ABOUT, STEMMED DIRECTLY from your Judea-
Christian scriptures, which in turn presented various opposing views and not
just the one view to which you’ve subscribed.

you gave us a sensational – FAITH-BASED piece of writing there, which


covered some aspects of the crucifixion without giving any real proof thereof.
<http://hisspace.ning.com/forum/topics/how-much-truth-is-in-this>

your own scriptures, especially the 4 gospels did not corroborate your
presentation in every detail. the rest was refutable as well. the new testament is
all i need to do the perfect job of it.

however, i dissected your article briefly by showing you that the old and the
new testaments spoke differently from millenniums past.

please review all the scriptural verses cited therein and my brief notes, text and
contexts with an open mind .

don’t feel threatened.

welcome the opportunity to learn anew.


let the truth ennoble you and not scare you.

1. remember, the so-called crucifixion, death and resurrection of Jesus Christ


did not take place ever.

2. this was a Judea-Christian scriptural fact.


read and review your own scriptures again.

i have given you ample material to get started and work on. simply start by
verifying the scriptures i have quoted.

1
follow the trend. or make your own connections.

don’t approach your scriptures with certain preconceived notions or try to


guide the scriptures.

they will only mislead you one too many times. and you will never know it.

3. Jesus was saved as DIVINELY promised.


4. do not contend with the DIVINE.

read the Psalms of David as quoted and substantiated by all 4 gospels


and the book of Hebrews.

THE SCRIPTURAL EVIDENCE IS RIGHT THERE.

5. more importantly, Thomas ‘DEMANDED EVIDENCE’ of crucifixion


from Jesus.

6. some 8-eight days later, Jesus concurred/conceded and provided


‘THE EXACT SAME EVIDENCE’ demanded of him.

7. however, there was no mention of the ‘NAILED FEET’ in either johannine


accounts.

8. but your sensational account spoke otherwise.

REMEMBER THAT ONE DEMANDED THE EVIDENCE AND THE


OTHER CONCEDED.

WHAT OTHER EVIDENCE ARE WE LOOKING FOR?

the fake shroud of turin?

9. and for his faithless or hypocritical outburst, Jesus Christ not only rebuked
Thomas lightly;

2
10. but more importantly, Jesus Christ blessed the FUTURE GENERATIONS
OF BELIEVERS. and not Thomas. that is telling is it not?

[John 20:28 KJV]


 And Thomas answered and said unto him,
 My Lord and my God.

[John 20:29 KJV]


 Jesus saith unto him,
 Thomas,
 BECAUSE
 thou hast seen me,
 thou hast believed:

 BLESSED ARE THEY


 THAT HAVE NOT SEEN,
 AND YET HAVE BELIEVED.

why did not Jesus Christ bless his apostle for declaring his DIVINITY, IF
INDEED JESUS WAS DIVINE? THINK ABOUT IT.

11. remember Jesus provided the EXACT SAME EVIDENCE of his


crucifixion, DEMANDED OF HIM.

but this was not the complete STORY.

I PROVIDED OTHER VIEWS AS WELL.

the CONFUSION CITED was created in the scriptures only. i merely


reproduced it, to your dismay.

prove me wrong by quoting the new testament ONLY.

don’t go cherry-picking as far as the Isaiah prophecies, etc. because the new
testament did not substantiate those prophecies fully.

3
i showed you a pre-Islamic account of crucifixion, in order to show that
JESUS FEET WERE NOT NAILED.

see my brief notes and what was highlighted therein for your perusal.

but you deliberately misinterpreted it for your personal reasons and attack on
me. so don’t blame me if you chose to ignore it.

the johannine and the re-islamic evidence were tied together. thus negating
your sensational hypothesis again.

and by the way, Jesus did not die of crucifixion according to the pre-Islamic
account. i have said nothing about it either.

the Islamic vis-à-vis the QUR’ANIC view remains unchanged and


unchallenged to date in all this.

we have the pre-islamic evidence in our favor namely, the torah, the old
testament, the new testament, the archeological and historical accounts to
prove it.

just take it as is. no twists and turns – no if and buts. just take it from the
horse’s mouth.

it is not a FAITH-BASED issue. it is a proven fact.

i gave detailed facts in my write-ups, corroborating and collaborating one


account with the other. all i ask is that you use your intelligence and connect
the dots.

but you find them confusing. because that is what your Judea-Christian
scriptures says.

and not because i disclosed them.

feel free to verify it.

4
Shalom

Health Research Books :


Publishing Rare and Unusual Books since ...

Book Details.
===>Crucifixion By An Eye Witness,
The by: Anonymous ISBN: 0-7873-0001-2 format:
Paperback pages: 200 Price: $15.40 Qty:

my earlier Reply

by ali

I SHALL NOT DIE, BUT LIVE


but he hath not given me
over unto death

(Psalms 118:17 ERRB) [19 & 17]


I shall not die, but live,
and declare scribe
the works of the LORD Yah .

(Psalms 118:18 ERRB) [19, 18 & 18]


In disciplining,
The LORD Yah hath
chastened disciplined me sore :

but he hath not given me


over unto death.
^^^^^^

5
COMPARE THE EVENTS IN JESUS CHRIST'S LIFE AS WELL

(Hebrews 5:7 KJV)


WHO IN THE DAYS OF HIS FLESH,
when he had offered up prayers
and supplications
with strong crying and tears

unto him that was able to


SAVE HIM FROM DEATH,

AND WAS HEARD IN THAT HE FEARED;

(Hebrews 5:8 KJV)


Though he were a Son,

YET LEARNED he obedience


BY THE THINGS WHICH HE SUFFERED;

note
JESUS CHRIST DID NOT DIE, BUT LIKE DAVID BEFORE HIM,
HE ALSO SUFFERED AT THE HANDS OF HIS ENEMIES.

HOWEVER, NO DEAD PERSON EVER LEARNS OBEDIENCE,


SAY, AFTER HIS DEATH.

Though he were a Son,


YET LEARNED he obedience
BY THE THINGS WHICH HE SUFFERED;

UNWILLING SACRIFICE or suicide

[1]
· UNTO HIM

6
· THAT WAS ABLE
· TO SAVE HIM FROM DEATH,
· AND WAS HEARD
· in that he feared;

[2]
REMOVE THIS CUP FROM ME
(Luke 22:42 KJV)

(Hebrews 5:7 KJV)


Who in the days of his flesh,
when he had offered up

PRAYERS AND SUPPLICATIONS


WITH STRONG CRYING AND TEARS
UNTO HIM

· THAT WAS ABLE


· TO SAVE HIM FROM DEATH,
· AND WAS HEARD
· in that he feared;

HIS GREATEST FEAR

Then saith he unto them,

MY SOUL IS

exceeding sorrowful,

even unto death:

tarry ye here,
and watch with me.

7
(Matthew 26:38 KJV)

And saith unto them,


MY SOUL IS
exceeding sorrowful
unto death:

tarry ye here,
and watch.

(Mark 14:34 KJV)


YESHUA WAS AFRAID TO DIE A SPIRITUAL DEATH.

HIS SOUL WAS EXCEEDINGLY SORROWFUL UNTO DEATH.

compare

Watch and pray,


that ye enter not into temptation:

the spirit indeed is willing,


but the flesh is weak.
(Matthew 26:41 KJV)
Watch ye and pray,
lest ye enter into temptation.

The spirit truly is ready,


but the flesh is weak.

(Mark 14:38 KJV)


Saying, Father,
if thou be willing,
remove this cup from me:
nevertheless not my will,
but thine, be done.

8
(Luke 22:42 KJV)
And there appeared
an angel unto him from heaven,
strengthening him.

(Luke 22:43 KJV)


And being in an agony
he prayed more earnestly:
and his sweat was
as it were great drops of blood
falling down to the ground.

(Luke 22:44 KJV) - (ref: Hebrews 5:7 KJV)


YESHUA WAS AFRAID TO DIE A PHYSICAL DEATH.
HIS FLESH WAS WEAK.

CORROBORATION

http://www.bsw.org/Biblica/Vol-81-2000/The-Crux-At-Hebrews-5-
7-8/294/

James Swetnam, «The Crux at Hebrews 5,7-8», Vol. 81 (2000) 347-361

Heb 5,7-8 is a classic crux. It is not clear, as the text seems to say, how
Jesus could beg to be freed from death and then be heard `although He
was son'. Further, it is not clear how Jesus could `learn obedience from
the things He suffered' since Hebrews pictures Him as antecedently
ready to do God's will.

One of the classic cruces in the Epistle to the Hebrews is the passage at
Heb 5,7-8 which speaks of the petitions made by Christ.

There are a number of problems associated with these verses, but one

9
problem is crucial: Jesus seems to be pictured as begging to be saved
from death and as having been heard.

But this seems to contradict the obvious fact that Jesus died

James Swetnam, «The Crux at Hebrews 5,7-8», Vol. 81 (2000) 347-361


[snip – a solution proposed].

Thomas was an unbelieving apostle.

[John 20:24 KJV]


But Thomas, one of the twelve,
called Didymus,
was not with them when Jesus came.
^^^^^^^^^^^

HIS PRECISE DEMANDS AND CONDITIONS

[John 20:25 KJV]


The other disciples therefore said unto him,
We have seen the Lord.

But he said unto them,


Except I shall see

1. in his hands the print of the nails,


2. and put my finger
3. into the print of the nails,
4. and thrust my hand into his side,
5. I will not believe.
^^^^^^^^^^

10
note
Thomas asked for no more -- not even for Jesus
NAILED FEET!

therefore, did Thomas witness the actual crucifixion?


how could he be so precise?

Jesus concurred and offered the exact same evidence asked for.

HE ALSO REBUKED THOMAS LIGHTLY.

[John 20:27 KJV]


Then saith he to Thomas,

1. Reach hither thy finger,


2. and behold my hands;
3. and reach hither thy hand,
4. and thrust it into my side:
5. AND BE NOT FAITHLESS,
BUT BELIEVING.

if the above johannine account was true then - 'How much truth is in
this email about "jesus." - is nothing more than a piece of sensational
writing, intended for just that purpose ONLY.
<http://hisspace.ning.com/forum/topics/how-much-truth-is-in-
this?xg_source=activity>

faith power works wonders.

additional supporting PRE-ISLAMIC


ARCHEOLOGICAL evidence also cited below.
AN 'EYE-WITNESS' ACCOUNT RELATED
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

11
only 7--seven passovers--years
after the event -- by a personal
friend of jesus in jerusalem to an
esseer [essene] brother in _a_l_e_x_a_n_d_r_i_a._

important warning

'after this they drove through


HIS HANDS thick iron nails,

'BUT _N_O_N_E_
THROUGH HIS FEET,

FOR THIS WAS _N_O_T_ CUSTOMARY'


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

the text and context

i. THEY TIED THE ARMS


ii. AS USUAL with strong cords,
and so tightly ...

iii. in the same manner


THEY _T_I_E_D_ HIS FEET .....

i. after this they drove through


HIS HANDS thick iron nails,

===>'BUT _N_O_N_E_

===>THROUGH HIS FEET,

===>FOR THIS WAS _N_O_T_ CUSTOMARY'

12
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

iii. i note this particularly, my dear brethren, inasmuch as


===>IT HAS BEEN RUMORED
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

iv. that he was nailed through both his hands


and his _f_e_e_t_ [pp. 60]
^^^^^^^^

Health Research Books :


Publishing Rare and Unusual Books since ...

Book Details.
===>Crucifixion By An Eye Witness,
The by: Anonymous ISBN: 0-7873-0001-2 format:
Paperback pages: 200 Price: $15.40 Qty:

Results 1 - 6 of 6 for 0-7873-0001-2. (0.06 seconds)


Search Results

1.
Health Research Books : Publishing Rare and Unusual Books since ...
Crucifixion By An Eye Witness, The by: Anonymous ISBN: 0-7873-
0001-2 · Paperback · On Sale! $16.00 $12.80 · Curious Facts, Myths, Legends.
...
www.healthresearchbooks.com/pages/books_category_list.php?cat... -
Cached
2.
Health Research Books : Publishing Rare and Unusual Books since ...

13
Crucifixion By An Eye Witness, The by: Anonymous ISBN: 0-7873-
0001-2 · Paperback · On Sale! $16.00 $12.80 · Law Of Financial Success, The
by: Anonymous ...
www.healthresearchbooks.com/pages/books_list.php?origin... - Cached
Show more results from www.healthresearchbooks.com
3.
The Islamic view of the crucifixion. - HisSpace
The by: Anonymous ISBN: 0-7873-0001-2 format: Paperback pages: 200
Price: $15.40 Qty: Ch.7, "Those Versatile Essenes" Beskow quotes from the
anonymous ...
hisspace.ning.com/forum/topics/the-islamic-view-of-the - Cached
4.
- The Crucifixion 9780787300012
- [ Translate this page ]
Pomeroy (US) : Health Research, 2002-09-01. Libro/Ed. Economica : pag.
202 175 cm. Ean/Isbn: 9780787300012 ( 0-7873-0001-2 ). Lingua: Inglese ...
www.libon.it/modules/libon/9780787300012.html
5.
BookFinder.com: ISBN list [e3ba0907]
(0787300012 9780787300012 0-7873-0001-2) · Manresa: The Spiritual
Exercises of St. Ignatius by Magnus Incognito (0787300020 9780787300029 0-
7873-0002-0) ...
www.bookfinder.com/dir/e3ba0907/ - Cached
6.
0787300012: "The Crucifixion: By an Eye Witness" @ JustBooks.co.uk
ISBN, 0787300012 / 9780787300012 / 0-7873-0001-2. Publisher, Health
Research. Language, English. Edition, Softcover. List price, $15.00 ...
www.justbooks.co.uk/dir/i/The_Crucifixion-By_an_Eye.../0787300012/

14