Gawker

Case 1:13-cv-04347-AJN Document 149 Filed 08/14/15 Page 1 of 74
IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

FOR THE SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK
AULISTAR MARK, et al., etc.,

Plaintiffs,
Case No.: 13-CV-04347 (AJN)
v.
GAWKER MEDIA LLC and NICK DENTON,

Defendants.
AFFIDAVIT OF MARK BATTEN
I, Mark Batten, hereby depose and state:

1.
I am a partner at the law firm ofProskauer Rose LLP. I make this declaration on
personal knowledge.
2.
True and correct excerpts from the deposition of Aulistar Mark are attached
hereto at Tab 1.
3.
True and correct excerpts from the deposition of Stephen Totilo are attached
hereto at Tab 2.
4.
True and correct excerpts from the deposition of Andrew Hudson are attached
hereto at Tab 3.
5.
A true and correct copy of an e-mail from Aulistar Mark to Stephen Totilo with
the subject: "Re: Offer of Kotaku Internship," which was Exhibit 3 at Mark's deposition, is
attached hereto at Tab 4.
6.
A true and correct copy of an e-mail from Stephen Totilo to Aulistar Mark with
the subject: "Re: Internship Guidelines," which was Exhibit 13 at Mark's deposition, is
7.
A true and correct copy of an e-mail from Aulistar Mark with the subject:
"Learning Agreement Form and Acceptance letter" with related attachments, which was Exhibit
14 at Mark's deposition, is attached hereto at Tab 6.
8.
A true and correct copy of an e-mail from Rebecca Schall to Aulistar Mark with
the subject: "Journall" with related attachments, which was Exhibit 16 at Mark's deposition, is
9.
the subject: "July TimeSheet and Supervisor Evaluation" with related attachments, which was
Exhibit 19 at Mark's deposition, is attached hereto at Tab 8.
10.
the subject: "Aulistar Mark- Intern of the Past" with related attachments, which was Exhibit 22
at Mark's deposition, is attached hereto at Tab 9.
I declare under the penalty of perjury that the foregoing is true and conect.
Dated: August 14, 2015
Tab 1
Page 1
1
A. Mark
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK
4
5
-------------------------------x
AULISTAR MARK, et al.,
Plaintiffs,
7
Civil Action
vs.
No. 13-cv-04347
8
9
(AIN)
GAWKER MEDIA
10
11
Defendants.
-------------------------------x
12
13
14
15
DEPOSITION OF AULISTAR MARK
16
New York, New York
17
Tuesday, April 8, 2014
18
19
20
21
22
23
Reported by:
24
THOMAS A. FERNICOLA, RPR
25
JOB NO. 71500

TSG Reporting - Worldwide
(877) 702-9580
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1
2
A. Mark
A.
Yes.
Before interning at Gawker, I
was a, of course, a journalism student at The
New School.
Q.
Uh-huh.
A.
Besides that I was also a writer for
the Hartford -- the University of Hartford
newspaper, as well as The New School
newspaper, essentially as reporter; two years
10
of reporting experience before moving on to
11
Gawker internship.
12
Q.
13
14
15
16
17
18
Uh-huh.
Anything else, any other journalism
experience?
A.
No.
No.
No, other journalism
experience.
Q.
What documents do you have that
relate to your internship at Gawker?
19
A.
With me, like say now or --
20
Q.
No.
21
Just in your possession in
general?
22
A.
In my possession in general.
23
Q.
Yes.
24
A.
I actually don't have any physical
25
documents; however, I do have all of the

(877) 702-9580
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1
A. Mark
Do you see that?
A.
Uh-huh.
Q.
Did you get college credit for this
internship?
A.
I did, yes.
Q.
Would you say you got additional
real world experience?
A.
Yes.
10
Q.
And did you get a foot into the door
11
of the world of video game journalism?
12
A.
No.
13
Q.
Why not?
14
A.
Huh.
So, no.
Because video game journalism
15
is a very difficult world to get into, with a
16
very limited amount of slots available for
17
actual journalists who would actually like to
18
do it, as with the journalism industry in
19
general.
20
21
22
Q.
There just aren't that many jobs; is
that what you're saying?

A.
There really aren't that many jobs.
23
So, essentially, I might have had an easier
24
time getting -- putting my foot into the door
25
of the world of video game journalism just by

(877) 702-9580
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1
2
A. Mark
A.
Essentially by attempting to be a
freelance video game journalist, by putting
stories to -- putting stories to websites,
websites and magazines, based around
technology and video games.
financially -- financially stable.
MS. PAPARELLA:
MR. BATTEN:
10
11
Can we take a break?
Sure.
(Recess taken from 2:35 p.m. to

2:44 p.m.)
12
13
It was not
(Mark's Exhibit 3, Series of

EMails, was marked for identification.)
14
BY MR. BATTEN:
15
Q.
Do you recognize Exhibit 3?
16
A.
One moment.
17
Q.
Sure.
18
A.
(Document Review.)
Take your time.
19
Okay.
20
Could you repeat the question.
21
Q.
Do you recognize these emails?
22
A.
Yes.
23
Q.
In the bottom one on the first page
24
from Stephen Totilo, he offers you the
25
opportunity to intern and says, "an unpaid for

(877) 702-9580
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1
2
A. Mark
credit editorial internship"; right?
A.
Correct.
Q.
So you knew before you started that
it was unpaid; correct?
A.
Correct.
Q.
Did you have a problem with that at
8
9
the time?
A.
Actually, I essentially made the
10
decision, I weighed the pros and cons.
11
course, I had a mother who says, why are you
12
working for free.
13
that working for free was worth the benefit of
14
having Gawker on my resume.
15
Q.
16
17
18
Of
But I made the decision
Okay.
And you were going to get college
credit also?
A.
I was going to get college credit
19
for it.
20
particularly interested in, although that was
21
an advantage.
22
23
24
25
Q.
That wasn't so much something I was
Why were you not particularly
interested in it?
A.
Because I didn't necessarily need
college credits and because it does complicate

(877) 702-9580
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1
2
A. Mark
Q.
3
4
I see.
And what tier did you selected?
A.
I selected the tier of six credits,
because I needed to get financial aid in order
to pay for the credits.
7
8
Q.
So six credits, is that what you
said?
A.
Yes.
10
Q.
And so how many hours a week did you
11
need to intern to get six credits?
12
A.
You needed to intern for 220 hours.
13
Q.
Total?
14
A.
The whole entire total, yes.
15
Q.
So it didn't matter how many in any
16
given week, as long as you hit the total at
17
the end?
18
19
A.
So, I needed to have a
total of 220 hours logged on my time sheets.
20
21
Essentially.
(Mark's Exhibit 4, EMail setting

Schedule, was marked for identification.)
22
BY MR. BATTEN:
23
Q.
Is Exhibit 4 the email you were
24
referring to where you set the start and end
25
date?
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1
A. Mark
(Mark's Exhibit 7, Internship
Proposal for The New School, was marked
for identification.)
BY MR. BATTEN:
A.
Okay.
Q.
Do you recognize this document?
A.
I don't.
Q.
Did you have to prepare an
10
internship proposal for The New School?
11
A.
I did.
12
Q.
Was that what this is?
13
A.
It looks like this is it.
14
Q.
Did you have to submit anything else
15
to The New School to get the internship
16
approved or was this enough?
17
A.
In order to qualify for credits at
18
The New School, it was required that you take
19
an internship class.
20
meet with an internship advisor who
21
essentially taught a class which had
22
additional things, like employment training
23
and resume writing, cover letter writing, on
24
top of discussing the -- our particular
25
internships and our internship experiences
So, once a week I had to

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1
A. Mark
with other students who were doing internships
through The New School or rather through
various employers throughout New York, but
still being required to take this internship
class once a week.
There was, of course, other
documents required as part of this internship
program, including time sheets and evaluations
10
from intern supervisors or the supervisors
11
chosen by, I guess the internship and the
12
particular intern or student.
13
it was Stephen Totilo.
14
Q.
15
In this case,
Uh-huh.
But to get the internship approved
16
in the first instance, was it just this piece
17
of paper?
18
19
A.
Can you rephrase the question?
Do
you mean -- get it approved by who?
20
Q.
By the school.
21
A.
To get the internship approved by
22
23
the school was just this piece of paper.

Now was this a question, did I have
24
to do internship evaluation in order to get an
25
internship?
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1
A. Mark
period of time where the internship, The New
School career services internship class, and,
therefore, like the period of time where this
occurred happened.
So, basically, my time sheets had to
reflect -- my time sheets had to reflect that
I worked this many hours in this particular
time; however, I can't tell you for sure about
10
the fact that I worked -- I was working
11
basically a month before and a couple weeks
12
after the internship.
13
And I believe I might have actually
14
asked if I could just then place those hours
15
and put it on a time sheet so it reflects on
16
the time sheet for official newspaper -- New
17
School paperwork that I worked 220 hours in
18
the time frame that The New School requires
19
this 220 hours to happen.
20
And it goes along with how I said
21
where interns would start for the internship
22
period and after the internship period or even
23
carry over their internship that they had in
24
the previous internship semester on to this
25
internship semester.
(877) 702-9580
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1
A. Mark
(Mark's Exhibit 14, The New School
Learning Agreement, was marked for
identification.)
THE WITNESS:
Okay.
BY MR. BATTEN:
Q.
What is this document?
A.
This is The New School College
learning agreement that's given to students
10
and they have to submit this as part of their
11
internship course.
12
13
Q.
Was your supervisor required to sign
off on this in some way?
14
A.
I believe he actually was.
Wherever
15
it says above his signature, that's
16
essentially where my supervisor had to sign
17
off and it had to be submitted to my
18
internship course supervisor,
19
counselor/supervisor.
20
Q.
21
Okay.
And this one isn't signed.
Do you
22
know whether Stephen signed it and returned
23
it?
24
A.
I don't know.
25
Q.
Okay.
I don't know.

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1
A. Mark
2
3
If you start with the second page,

which looks like a cover letter form.
A.
Uh-huh.
Q.
It's dated June 24, 2010.
Do you see that?
A.
Yes.
Q.
So you were about a month into the
internship at this point; is that right?
10
A.
Uh-huh.
11
Q.
And you described Kotaku in the body
12
of the letter as one of the epicenters of
13
video game journalism.
14
15
16
17
Is that how you felt at the time?

A.
Yes.
It still is.
That's how I
feel right now.

Q.
18
Uh-huh.
"And to be given an opportunity to
19
work for Kotaku is an experience that many
20
covet and few would think to pass up."
21
Is that how you felt at the time?
22
A.
Yes.
23
Q.
Okay.
24
25
If you turn two pages on to the page

that starts Learning Goals/Objective No. 1.
(877) 702-9580
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1
A. Mark
Do you see that?
A.
Uh-huh.
Q.
And I gather you wrote, "Learn to
write/investigate in a fast-paced
environment"; correct?
A.
Yes.
Q.
Did you write that or did Stephen
write that?
10
A.
I don't know for sure.
11
Q.
Okay.
12
13
Well, it's described as the learning

goal or objective; right?
14
A.
Yes.
15
Q.
Okay.
16
So I believe I wrote it.
And do you feel like you achieved
17
that goal?
18
A.
I mean, the truth is that when I did
19
a lot of this paperwork, I essentially did it
20
just to get it done because I didn't care.
21
As an internship, they required that
22
I have a learning goal and objective, and I
23
needed to have a learning agreement to do an
24
internship.
25
Q.
Understood.
(877) 702-9580
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1
2
A. Mark
A.
And so essentially I wrote that I'm
going to learn to write and investigate.
was the truth and that's essentially what I
wrote here on this piece of paper.
Q.
And so I'm asking, according to that
document, did you learn to write and
investigate in a fast-paced environment?
That
A.
If anything, I built on my previous
10
experience and I actually had the opportunity
11
to work in a fast-paced news environment or a
12
faster pace news environment like Gawker under
13
tight deadlines and with working with other
14
editorial staff.
15
16
17
So, in that case, yes, I gained

experience.
Q.
I did learn some things.
18
Uh-huh.
Learning Goal/Objective No. 2,
19
half-way down the page, says, "Fine tune my
20
writing style to the progressive world of
21
blogging."
22
23
Would you say you achieved that?

A.
Yes, I'd say I achieved that.
24
25

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1
2
A. Mark
first paragraph.
Q.
End of the first paragraph.
A.
Yes, that's accurate.
Q.
Uh-huh.
Then at the bottom of that same
page, you say, "Overall, I look forward to the
next two months with optimism"; right?
A.
Yes.
10
Q.
"It's been a slow and gradual start,
11
but I feel I can say I've been learning more
12
about my craft, as well as what I'm capable of
13
than I've ever learned in a classroom."
14
15
Is that how you felt?

A.
I felt, going into Kotaku, that it
16
was really more of like a work experience
17
than, say -- I guess I would basically -- yes,
18
it was more a work experience than a learning
19
experience.
20
I felt like I benefited from being
21
dropped into what was essentially a work
22
experience.
23
24
25
Q.
Okay.
And did you learn more about your
craft as well as what you're capable of than

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1
2
3
A. Mark
you had ever learned in a classroom?
A.
I did, because I've never been
required to write as many articles as quickly
as I had to have written them as I was at
Kotaku.
know, draft and write several posts a day,
have them published and do it again the next
day or the next time I was in the office.
10
Q.
Never before have I had to both, you
Okay.
11
"I've had internships in the past,
12
both good and bad, but not as truly hands-on
13
as Kotaku."
14
15
Is that true?
A.
Yes.
Because my previous
16
internships, I didn't really get to -- like
17
being able to just write something and see it
18
on the Internet, like here's I show you within
19
an hour is not something that -- when I was at
20
the West Hartford Community Television, I was
21
essentially with a mentor and he walked me
22
through ever every single step of, you know,
23
initially video editing.
24
learned how to video edit on something called
25
Video Toaster.
That's where I first
No one uses.
It's from the

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1
A. Mark
'80s and '90s.
of a mentor teaching me how to do what he
already knows how to do.
But there it was really sort
At Blue Magazine it was really sort
of -- it was really -- that's really some of
the ones of those terrible internships where,
okay, you're in the office, yes, you're
writing a newsletter.
But I felt like I
10
didn't really accomplish as much as I
11
accomplished at Kotaku.
12
At Kotaku I appreciated the fact I
13
was basically treated as a writer.
And so I
14
obviously worked as a blog writer.
I was -- I
15
had high expectations on me, and I feel like I
16
then produced, you know, I produced stuff and
17
I kind of proven to myself that I was capable
18
of doing these multiple stories and working at
19
the speed and working in a work environment
20
like Kotaku, and I appreciated the fact that I
21
had that experience, I learned that about
22
myself.
23
24
25

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1
A. Mark
A.
Second column -- sorry.
Q.
Down here at the bottom.
A.
Oh, yes, sorry.
Q.
Uh-huh.
What?
Last comment.
"Have you been able to talk to your
supervisor about ways in which he feels you
can grow in tools of the trade."
Do you see that?
10
A.
I do.
11
Q.
Did you talk to Stephen about that?
12
A.
I don't remember, so I don't know.
13
Q.
All right.
14
If you turn to the next page, which
15
is stamped 190 at the bottom.
16
the second comment, which is it says C6,
17
Ms. Schmall writes, "It sounds as though you
18
are learning to work within the ebbs and flows
19
of the media industry and its inconsistent
20
schedules."
21
22
If you look at
Do you agree with that?

A.
Yes, I agree with that.
I agree
23
that doing an internship at Kotaku made me, as
24
she said, I learned the ebbs and flows and the
25
schedule that is working in the media

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1
A. Mark
industry, and I continued, you know, to do
that even though.
Q.
Uh-huh.
And the next comment she says, "You
are gaining very valuable experience and
increasing your skill set."
8
9
Do you agree with that?

A.
I believe I did.
I did some -- I
10
tried some initial things at Kotaku.
11
did photo editing where I edited a picture of
12
the president of Nintendo on top of a pirate
13
ship.
14
to do before.
15
Like I
That is not something that I knew how
I just said, okay, do I know how to
16
use Photoshop, I guess I do, let me do it.
17
I did get to try some things that might have
18
not have tried if I hadn't had to like
19
essentially prove myself at Kotaku.
20
21
Q.
So
Okay.
And at the bottom it says, the last
22
comment on that same page, she writes, "It
23
sounds as though you are building confidence
24
and learning deeply about yourself."
25
Do you think she was right about

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1
A. Mark
to Stephen Totilo on April 2nd, 2011, you say,
"Once again, thank you for giving me the
opportunity to work under you at Kotaku.
learned a lot and have moved forward since
then."
Is that true?
A.
That's true.
Q.
And you ask him if he'd write a
10
general recommendation letter as a previous
11
boss and mentor; right?
12
A.
I did.
13
Q.
Do you consider him a mentor?
14
A.
I do.
15
Q.
And he says he'd be happy to write a
16
letter of recommendation in the next email.
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
That's true.
Did he -- did he do that?

A.
I never received a letter of
recommendation, unfortunately.
MR. BATTEN:
All right.
Let's take
a moment.
(Recess taken from 4:25 p.m. to
4:28 p.m.)
MR. BATTEN:
I have nothing further.
Thank you.
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2
--------------------------------------X
Plaintiffs,
7
8
- against-
Civil Action No.

13-cv-04347-AJN
10
11
GAWKER MEDIA LLC, and NICK DENTON,
12
13
Defendants.
--------------------------------------X
14
15
October 14, 2014
16
10:18 a.m.
17
18
Deposition of Defendant Gawker Media
19
LLC by STEPHEN TOTILO, held at the offices
20
of Liddle & Robinson, L.L.P., 800 Third
21
Avenue, New York, New York, pursuant to
22
Notice, before NANCY SORENSEN, a Notary
23
Public of the State of New York.
24
25
212-279-9424
VERITEXT REPORTING COMPANY

www.veritext.com
212-490-3430
Page 26
1
S. Totilo
A.
No.
Q.
If you didn't assign an intern work,
4
5
who would assign an intern their work?

A.
The interns, when we would have them,
would come in and have some expectations and
understanding of what their opportunities were.
8
9
10
And at times, if a writer thought

that the intern could help them out, might ask
for help.
11
At times, the intern might show the
12
initiative to volunteer to do something.
13
times, the interns were occupied without, I
14
would say, anybody assigning them.
15
So at
It was very much the way we operated.
16
If you have ideas and you show initiative and
17
you do things.
18
when I would encourage an intern to, say, pitch
19
articles.
20
And there are also instances
I don't know if we would consider
21
that assigning or not.
22
must do this or else.
23
saying it would be great if you could write
24
something.
25
article.
212-279-9424
It's not me saying you

It's me encouraging and
You should go, maybe write an

Things like that.
www.veritext.com
212-490-3430
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1
2
3
4
5
S. Totilo
of the piece by the time it was published.
Q.
How much time did you spend with him
on this?
A.
I don't recall specifically.
But
like I said, this was wasn't a, let's talking
about it on a Monday and it gets published on a
Tuesday.
This was a series of weeks of him
10
forming the idea going out, reporting.
11
giving feedback on drafts.
12
Me
It was much longer than is the
13
typical period of time that a writer would be
14
working on an article at Kotaku.
15
Q.
So how long did he work on it for?
16
A.
I don't recall specifically.
17
Q.
So how do you know it was longer than
18
a typical writer would spend on an article at
19
Kotaku?
20
A.
Kotaku writers write 2, 3, 4, 5, 6,
21
some 10 posts a day.
22
short.
23
Some of them are quite
But even the larger reporting pieces,
24
a writer can do that and turn that around in a
25
day or two, if need be.
212-279-9424

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2
3
4
S. Totilo
interesting articles on the site.
Q.
So it was helpful to have interns
looking for these republishes; right?
A.
Sure.
Q.
If you look at the paragraph before
that starts, "Start your intern day," do you see
where I'm referring to?
A.
Yup.
10
Q.
It goes on to say that they should go
11
back through the past 24 hours worth of posts
12
and copy editing.
13
"This means reading through the posts
14
and then alerting us in camp with any mistakes
15
you find.
16
to fix them."
We'll then give you the green light
17
A.
Um-hmm.
18
Q.
Can you tell by this what
19
20
21
Mr. Crecente is asking interns to do?

A.
He's asking the interns to help copy
edit articles on the site.
22
Q.
For what purpose?
23
A.
To help improve the articles and,
24
25
obviously, give them more experience with this.

Q.
212-279-9424
Is this something you've ever asked

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S. Totilo
-- that anybody at Kotaku has asked full-time
employees to do, to go back and look over the
past 24 hours at posts to copy edit them?
A.
Not that I recall.
Q.
It says, "Each of you will be tapped
to help out with reporting and writing."
A.
Um-hmm.
Q.
When it says, "help out," who is it
10
11
referring to, as best as you can tell?

A.
He's asking or he's advising the
12
interns that they'd be tapped to help others on
13
the Kotaku staff, or himself, with reporting and
14
writing.
15
Q.
Does Gawker still have interns?
16
A.
I don't think so.
But, again, I'm
17
more capable of speaking to Kotaku than Gawker
18
as a whole.
19
Q.
Does Kotaku have any interns?
20
A.
No.
21
Q.
Why not?
22
A.
It's not -- in my judgment as
23
editor-in-chief, it's not really -- it takes a
24
lot of time to mentor and work with interns, and
25
you don't get a huge amount of work out of them.
212-279-9424

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212-490-3430
Page 80
1
2
S. Totilo
couldn't do the research project.
3
4
The copy editing, unfortunately,

probably just wouldn't have gotten done.
5
6
Q.
When was the last time Kotaku had
interns?
A.
We had interns in the early part of
2012, right after I took over as
editor-in-chief.
10
interns that I can recall.
11
12
And those were the last
Q.
So did you make the decision to stop
having interns?
13
A.
Yeah.
14
Q.
Was it in consultation with anyone
A.
No, we had one editorial fellow after
15
16
17
18
else?
that, but I just decided it wasn't worth it.

Q.
So the editorial fellow sort of took
19
on the role that interns typically were
20
assigned?
21
A.
Yeah, more or less, yes.
22
Q.
And they were paid; right?
23
A.
Yes.
24
Q.
Why were they paid?
25
A.
I remember being told that we were
212-279-9424

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1
S. Totilo
A.
For an intern in New York like
Aulistar, it was when he would be in the office,
you know, showing up and leaving.
Or for remote interns, it would
similarly be when they'd check in or check out
of Campfire, the chat room that we use to all
talk.
I mean, of course, it's, these are
10
media jobs, so the hours aren't quite fixed for
11
those who actually work them.
12
They're not quite fixed even if
13
you're an intern kind of learning the
14
experience, so there's a fluidity there.
15
you, you know, sort of use those guidelines.
16
Q.
But
So if you wanted to look back at
17
these chat room logs, assuming they still
18
existed, you could see when an intern, I guess,
19
got to work and left work; is that right?
20
A.
Well, you wouldn't really see that
21
for an intern based in the New York office
22
because you wouldn't know when they walked in
23
the door or when they left, necessarily.
24
25
Although they might say hey, I'm here

or I'm not.
212-279-9424
And similar, if you're remote, you

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1
2
3
S. Totilo
might see them saying that, you might not.
Q.
So there's no requirement that they
let people know that they were there or when
they were leaving, as far as you remember?
A.
There was a custom to say hi and
good-bye.
clock or punching or anything like that, no.
9
10
11
Q.
But, no, I mean there's no like time
Did interns receive any training
other than hands-on training?

A.
The only training, if you want to
12
call it that, is the continued exposure to
13
working with full-time Kotaku writers and
14
reporters, while they're doing their internship,
15
as far as I can recall.
16
Q.
So if you're a full-time writer or
17
editor of Kotaku, you're presumably getting that
18
same training that an intern would be getting,
19
right, because you're, like you just described,
20
working with other editors and writers at
21
Kotaku; is that fair?
22
A.
No.
23
Q.
Why is it not fair?
24
A.
Because in your question you're
25
implying that the skill set of an intern is
212-279-9424

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Page 119
1
S. Totilo
2
3
Q.
Are you saying that the sites don't
all have the same positions?
A.
Every site has the editor-in-chief,
as far as I am aware.
really checked.
Although I have not
Sites have deputy editors or managing
editors.
Sites have reporters, but it's like we
have video editors on our team.
A lot of the
10
other sites don't have video editors.
11
it differs from site to site.
12
Q.
So, yeah,
Do you know of any intern ever being
13
disciplined in any way by Gawker or their weblog
14
or anything like that?
15
16
21
Q.
If you ever had a problem with an
intern, what would you do about it?
19
20
I don't remember anything like that,
no.
17
18
A.
A.
I guess it depends what the problem
Q.
That's fair.
was.
Is it something that
22
you would handle by yourself or would there be a
23
situation where you'd be compelled to speak to
24
somebody from the parent company Gawker?
25
A.
212-279-9424
You're dealing in hypotheticals.

www.veritext.com
If
212-490-3430
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1
S. Totilo
by "problem," we mean the type of things that
you expect from an extremely junior and green
person who's learning, the problem may be they
missed a deadline or something or their story
pitches are bad or it's entirely appropriate
that you'd work internally within the editorial
team.
If you mean something beyond that, I
10
guess I would have reached out to others in the
11
company for, you know, advice about what should
12
I do.
13
But we're in hypotheticals.
I don't
14
recall ever having a problem with any of our
15
interns that required anything beyond the
16
editorial team's involvement.
17
18
MR. ADLER:
Let's take another very
short break.
19
(Brief recess taken.)
20
FURTHER EXAMINATION
21
BY MR. ADLER:
22
Q.
Do you know who Gaby Darbyshire is?
23
A.
Yes.
24
Q.
Who is she?
25
A.
She's one of the early employees of
212-279-9424

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212-490-3430
Tab 3
Page 1
1
A. Hudson
4
5
-------------------------------x
Plaintiffs,
7
Civil Action
vs.
No. 13-cv-04347
8
9
(AIN)
GAWKER MEDIA
10
11
Defendants.
-------------------------------x
12
13
14
15
DEPOSITION OF ANDREW HUDSON
16
New York, New York
17
Tuesday, April 8, 2014
18
19
20
21
22
23
Reported by:
24
THOMAS A. FERNICOLA, RPR
25
JOB NO. 71500

(877) 702-9580
Page 8
1
A. Hudson
Q.
When was that?
A.
I went to college here; so, four
4
5
years, from 2005 through 2009.

Q.
Okay.
What college did you attend?
A.
Fordham College at Lincoln Center.
Q.
Did you get a degree?
A.
Yes.
10
Q.
What was that?
11
A.
BA in political science.
12
Q.
Where did you go to high school?
13
A.
Webster Groves High School in
14
15
16
Webster Groves, Missouri.

Q.
Did you have any other educational
degrees other than the BA from Fordham?
17
A.
No.
18
Q.
Have you attended any other classes?
19
A.
No.
20
Q.
Okay.
21
22
Other than political science, what

did you study at Fordham?
23
A.
I had a minor in creative writing.
24
Q.
And what did that involve in terms
25
of the work?
(877) 702-9580
Page 9
1
2
A. Hudson
A.
I mean, a number of classes and, you
know, English classes and journalism classes
that together construed the creative writing
program.
Q.
7
8
9
Okay.
So there was a journalism component
to it; is that right?

A.
Yes.
That was one of the ways that
10
you could get the minor, I believe; and, so, I
11
took a journalism workshop and some journalism
12
classes and those turned into a communication
13
major with a creative writing minor.
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
Q.
So creative writing didn't
necessarily mean fiction; is that right?

A.
Not necessarily, but there were some
other classes.
Q.
So which journalism classes did you
take?
A.
I took the journalism workshop twice
21
or three times.
22
involved working on the student newspaper at
23
Fordham, Lincoln Center.
24
writing, online journalism.
25
Twice.
Which basically
I took magazine
That's all I can remember.

(877) 702-9580
Page 12
1
A. Hudson
at -- I applied broadly to a number of
different schools.
Q.
What Ph.D. program is that?
A.
Depending on the school, it was
6
7
8
9
10
either political science or sociology.

Q.
Have you been accepted in any of
those programs?
A.
No.
I got accepted to me one, but
it was a lot of money to go, so...
11
Q.
Where was that?
12
A.
That was at The New School.
13
Q.
Are there places that you're waiting
14
to hear from still?
15
A.
16
back, yes.
17
Q.
18
No.
This was -- this was a while
Was The New School the only school
from which you received an acceptance?
19
A.
Yes.
20
Q.
What have you been doing since you
21
22
left Fordham, since you graduated?

A.
I've been working as a journalist,
23
editor, consultant, writer, communications
24
consultant.
25

(877) 702-9580
Page 56
1
A. Hudson
certainly a business like Gawker is based on
producing a constant stream of new content
throughout the day.
Q.
How many posts on average appeared
on io9 per day during the time you were
interning there?
A.
I don't recall.
Q.
Can you give me a ballpark?
10
A.
Probably dozens may -- a dozen or
11
maybe several dozen.
12
it was something like, you know, multiple
13
posts every hour for the workday.
14
15
THE WITNESS:
I don't recall.
I think
I'm going to run to
the restroom, if that's okay.
16
MR. BATTEN:
17
(Recess taken from 11:00 a.m. to
18
11:05 a.m.)
19
BY MR. BATTEN:
20
Q.
21
22
Sure.
How did you first hear about
internships at io9?
A.
My roommate at the time, Fred Tann
23
(phonetic), had been a regular reader of io9,
24
and he saw a posting on the blog mentioning
25
that they were looking for summer interns and

(877) 702-9580
Page 59
1
A. Hudson
discovery?
A.
I had seen it.
I had seen it around
since it launched.
first launched because Cory Doctorow posted
about it and I read, you know, his work on
BoingBoing.net, and so I visited them when it
came out and occasionally when things got sent
to me.
10
Q.
11
I think I saw it when it
Did you apply for interns other than
at io9, either at Gawker blogs or elsewhere?
12
A.
At that -- at that time?
13
Q.
At this time, yes.
14
A.
I don't believe so.
15
Q.
Did the posting that you reviewed
16
and were responding to here in Exhibit 2, did
17
it say that the internship was unpaid?
18
A.
I don't recall.
19
Q.
Do you remember when you found out
20
21
the internship was unpaid?

A.
It was either in that posting, if
22
they mentioned it, or if it was when I first
23
spoke with an editor from io9, I think
24
probably Charlie.
25
Q.
In addition to the email from

(877) 702-9580
Page 61
1
A. Hudson
experience, my skills, my interests, those
sort of things.
Q.
So, in any case, you knew before you
started the internship that it was going to be
unpaid; correct?
A.
Yes.
Q.
Did that trouble you at the time?
A.
I certainly would have preferred a
10
paid internship, but it was a -- it didn't
11
seem like the -- it didn't seem like the
12
biggest deal, but I thought it was going to
13
get a good experience out of it.
14
15
16
Q.
So it didn't seem exploitive to you
at the time?
A.
At the time I was not as conscious
17
of the problematic nature of unpaid
18
internships and the effects they have on the
19
workforce and the people that take them and
20
sort of society in general.
21
And I guess I thought I was going to
22
get a good training experience out of it.
23
I just -- I wasn't as aware of, you know, some
24
of the basic ideas of people should be paid
25
for their labor.

(877) 702-9580
And
Page 62
1
A. Hudson
I mean, I think I probably believed
that, but it wasn't something that was at the
forefront of my mind.
Q.
Was academic credit discussed in
these conversations before your internship
began?
A.
I don't recall.
It may have.
But
if it was, it was brief, because it didn't
10
seem like something that -- like we were going
11
to be able to arrange academic credit and,
12
anyways, I didn't need any more credits to
13
graduate.
14
And I wasn't sure how taking
15
academic credit would -- for an internship
16
would play into my scholarship at Fordham,
17
so...
18
19
20
Q.
Did Fordham offer credit for
internships as a general matter?

A.
I think they definitely did offer
21
credit for internships, but I think that the
22
broad spectrum of universities, they were more
23
stringent about what qualified for credit and
24
the requirements you had to -- the hoops you
25
had to jump through to get credit for them.

(877) 702-9580
Page 63
1
2
3
A. Hudson
Q.
In any case, I take it you never
pursued credit from Fordham; is that right?
A.
Correct.
Q.
Did you speak to anybody at Fordham
about the possibility of credit for this
internship.
A.
Not that I recall.
Q.
Did you read about Fordham's
10
internship practices?
11
A.
Yes.
12
Q.
Was the possibility of employment, a
13
paying job at io9 or elsewhere within Gawker,
14
ever discussed before you started your
15
internship?
16
A.
I think it was mentioned that they
17
had hired or might hire interns, but it wasn't
18
promised, if that's what you're asking.
19
20
But, yes, I think it was sort of

discussed as a possibility.
21
Q.
You didn't take it as a promise?
22
A.
No.
23
Q.
When did you first talk about a
24
25
schedule with anyone?

A.
After they offered me the internship

(877) 702-9580
Page 63
1
2
3
A. Hudson
Q.
In any case, I take it you never
pursued credit from Fordham; is that right?
A.
Correct.
Q.
Did you speak to anybody at Fordham
about the possibility of credit for this
internship.
A.
Not that I recall.
Q.
Did you read about Fordham's
10
internship practices?
11
A.
Yes.
12
Q.
Was the possibility of employment, a
13
paying job at io9 or elsewhere within Gawker,
14
ever discussed before you started your
15
internship?
16
A.
I think it was mentioned that they
17
had hired or might hire interns, but it wasn't
18
promised, if that's what you're asking.
19
20
But, yes, I think it was sort of

discussed as a possibility.
21
Q.
You didn't take it as a promise?
22
A.
No.
23
Q.
When did you first talk about a
24
25
schedule with anyone?

A.
After they offered me the internship

(877) 702-9580
Page 65
1
2
A. Hudson
Q.
The email from Charlie Jane Anders
that appears at the beginning of Exhibit 2
says that you "would be working with our news
reporter, Meredith."
That's Meredith Woerner; is that
right?
A.
Correct.
Q.
"On gathering info for news stories
10
and features that she is working on."
11
12
Is that something that you did

during your internship?
13
A.
Yes.
14
Q.
"Plus promoting her stories to other
15
sites and social networks."
16
Did you do that?
17
A.
Yes.
18
Q.
And that description sounded
19
appealing to you, obviously, at the time;
20
right?
21
A.
22
internship.
23
24
25
Appealing enough that I took the

I wasn't dissuaded, yes.
It's not a very detailed description

but, you know.
Q.
Were you pleased to be offered the

(877) 702-9580
Page 84
1
A. Hudson
And if I found any, I would send
those on to Meredith.
interesting things that would be relevant, I
would -- it's not exactly like pitching, but
it's assisting in finding stories that became
posts.
Q.
Or any other weird,
All right.
So maybe I understood.
I thought
10
you had said before that you sent ideas to
11
Meredith saying here's something that someone
12
else could --
13
A.
No.
No.
I helped Meredith with her
14
job as a reporter finding stories to write
15
about.
16
17
Does that make sense?

Q.
18
19
20
Yes.
Thank you.
Did you learn anything from your

internship?
A.
I learned not to take an unpaid
21
internship.
22
lesson.
23
from managing people.
That's maybe the biggest life
And I learned some what not to do's
24
Q.
For example?
25
A.
For example, in working with Graeme

(877) 702-9580
Tab 4
Tab 5
Tab 6
Tab 7
Tab 8
Tab 9

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Case 1:13-cv-04347-AJN Document 149 Filed 08/14/15 Page 1 of 74

IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

AULISTAR MARK, et al., etc.,

GAWKER MEDIA LLC and NICK DENTON,

AFFIDAVIT OF MARK BATTEN

I, Mark Batten, hereby depose and state:

Case 1:13-cv-04347-AJN Document 149 Filed 08/14/15 Page 2 of 74

Dated: August 14, 2015

Case 1:13-cv-04347-AJN Document 149 Filed 08/14/15 Page 3 of 74

Case 1:13-cv-04347-AJN Document 149 Filed 08/14/15 Page 4 of 74

UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK

DEPOSITION OF AULISTAR MARK

New York, New York

Tuesday, April 8, 2014

THOMAS A. FERNICOLA, RPR

JOB NO. 71500

Case 1:13-cv-04347-AJN Document 149 Filed 08/14/15 Page 5 of 74

Before interning at Gawker, I

was a, of course, a journalism student at The

Besides that I was also a writer for

the Hartford -- the University of Hartford

newspaper, as well as The New School

newspaper, essentially as reporter; two years

of reporting experience before moving on to

No, other journalism

What documents do you have that

relate to your internship at Gawker?

With me, like say now or --

Just in your possession in

I actually don't have any physical

documents; however, I do have all of the

Case 1:13-cv-04347-AJN Document 149 Filed 08/14/15 Page 6 of 74

Do you see that?

Did you get college credit for this

Would you say you got additional

real world experience?

And did you get a foot into the door

of the world of video game journalism?

Because video game journalism

is a very difficult world to get into, with a

very limited amount of slots available for

actual journalists who would actually like to

do it, as with the journalism industry in

There just aren't that many jobs; is

that what you're saying?

There really aren't that many jobs.

So, essentially, I might have had an easier

time getting -- putting my foot into the door

of the world of video game journalism just by

Case 1:13-cv-04347-AJN Document 149 Filed 08/14/15 Page 7 of 74

freelance video game journalist, by putting

stories to -- putting stories to websites,

websites and magazines, based around

technology and video games.

financially -- financially stable.

Can we take a break?

(Recess taken from 2:35 p.m. to

(Mark's Exhibit 3, Series of

Do you recognize Exhibit 3?

Take your time.

Could you repeat the question.

Do you recognize these emails?

In the bottom one on the first page