Post by Ruby

Basic Facts
Jay Adams quote Psychology is just sinful human beings sinfully thinking about sinful
human beings., may have some truth deep within the statement. At the very basic level our
MacArthur, (1997) informs us in Jeremiah 17:9 "The heart is deceitful above all things, and
desperately wicked; Who can know it? (p. 1087) As children of God, our heart, the very essence
of who we are is deceitful and sick according to His word. Another scripture that comes to mind
is MacArthur, (1997) notes, Psalms 51:5, Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin my
mother conceived me. (p. 789) This indicates to me that we are born of sin and conceived in sin.
I use these two scriptures as evidence of what Jay Adams was speaking of. I have heard many
pastors, preachers, ministers and lay leaders of the church say, We are all sick, and the church is
the hospital where we come to obtain our instructions for healing. So if we are born of sin,
conceived in sin are deceitful and sick, why would we not seek help via some form of Christian
counseling? Using Mr. Adams quote to re-think the basic facts of the quote, Psychology is just
sinful human beings - MacArthur, (1997) in Romans 3:23 reads for all have sinned and fall
short of the glory of God, p. 1698). Jay Adams sinfully thinking about sinful human beings
Romans 7:15, I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I
do. (p. 1706) I believe we sin only three ways, thought, word and deed. Every sin comes from
these three; we think, we speak, we do, and thinking is the beginning. I believe Jay Adams was
correct in his statement, though not for the same reasons.
Evaluation
I believe that Psychology and Christian counseling can be integrated. Entwistle, (2010)
statement Antagonistic models are based on the belief that psychology and theology are
mutually exclusive. They are adversaries that are always in skirmish, and never far from an all
out war. (Entwistle, 2010), seem to believe it cannot. I believe that is human nature. Christian
combatants and Secular combatants are exclusive in their beliefs that they are right. One
constantly strives to be more right and therefore better than the other. If we take the view of the
preachers, pastors and ministers I mentioned above, we go to the church to heal. As we read,
study, and fellowship one with another, we use our talents and gifts from God to help each other
through the struggles in our lives. When we seek counseling for issues that plague us, we are
seeking assistance in removing the sins in our lives that keep us from truly living a Spirit filled
life under the leading and direction of the Holy Spirit. I believe we seek God out in mans way,
because we cant hear Gods voice due to our not listening. Each time God speaks, and we turn
to our own way, His voice becomes less and less audible. When this happens, we look to man
and different therapies to find what is already within us.
I believe that we are sinful people, thinking sinful things, speaking sinful words, doing
sinful deeds. MacArthur, (1997) in Mark 10:18 reads So Jesus said to him, Why do you call
me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good--except God alone. (p. 1482) We are not God, but
made in the image of God, so we sin. I believe it is healthy to seek out help. Our help should
come from God first, but if we have strayed away from God, and can hear His voice, we may
need the assistance of man, whether it is our friends, family, teacher or counselors. This may be
far fetches as an example, but take this class for example of seeking help. APA is not one of my
strength. I prayed over my first paper before I turned it in. I thought it was pretty good. When I
received my grade and the write-up, well I was not as good as I thought. Dr. Meyer, assisted me
with the challenges of APA and some writing tips as well. As my ego (thinking I had done a

pretty good job) was deflating, I started re-writing the paper to improve my writing and
understanding of APA. We are all seeking to improve upon ourselves through the assistance of
man in one form or another. God is like that. He corrects us, moves us and loves us enough to
say that is not good enough. Even though we are born of and in sin, He loves us enough to
correct and nurture us to health and healing.

Post by Lisa

Psychologyismansattempttounderstandhumannatureusingscienceandreason.
Whileitistruethatbecauseofthefallandoriginalsin,mansthoughtsareimperfectand
partial,itdoesnotnegatethefactthatGodgavehumanstheabilitytoreason(Entwistle,2010,
p.12).Whilesomehumanbehaviorleadstopoorchoicesthatleadtomentalillness,thisisnot
alwaysthecase.Thereareagreatnumberofpsychologicalillnessesthatarebiologicallybased,
whichcouldnotbeconsideredtheresultofsinfulchoices.Topresentthatmentalillnessisonly
theresultofsinleavesagreatmanypeopledisenfranchisedandwithoutthegraceGodoffers.
Claimingthatillness,mentalorphysicalissimplytheresultofsincouldleadaclientto
searchingforthesourceoftheirsin,ortofindmorefaith,insteadofseekingtreatment.
PsychologyandChristiancounselingcanandshouldbeintegrated.WhileGodsWordis
allencompassing,italsofrequentlyreferencestimeswhenGodimpartednonspiritualwisdomto
otherstobringHispurposestopass.Geometryandwoodworkingwerenecessaryfortheark,
despiteGodscommandtobuildit.TheIsraelitesweretoldbyGodtotakefromPharaohsland
beforetravelingintothewildernesssotheywereprepared(Crabb,1977).Pastoralcounseling
withoutknowledgeableinterpretationofGodswordandcompetencyinmentalhealthtreatment
isignoranceatbest. Whiletheintentisgood,itcanleadtofurtherharm,especiallywhen
Christswordisusedasthebase.Onemustnotsimplyrelyoncounselingorpreaching,butmust
ensurethatbothareincongruencewithGodsword.Godswordshouldbethefoundation,but
alsoafilterthroughwhichallotherknowledgepassesbeforeitisincorporatedintoaclients
treatment.
Crabb,L.J.Jr.(1977).Effectivebiblicalcounseling:Amodelforhelpingcaring christians
becomecapablecounselors.GrandRapids,Michigan:ZondervanPublishingHouse.

Entwistle, D. (2010). Integrative approaches to psychology and

christianity: An introduction to worldview issues. Philosophical
foundations and models of integration. Eugene, OR: Cascade Books.