Grassroot Discussion #7: A Conversation on Sex, Shame, & Intimacy in the Muslim Community

December 11, 2015

Ariana: Establishes comfortable environment & begins:
Why are we here?
The Early Community
Gender differences and double standards
Why talking about sex? Marriage is half of deen? Big part is sex.
Community Inclusion
Sexual choices
Prophet discussed: Menstruation, sex during menstruation, pubic hair.
Marital sex is requirement and abstinence. in us, shying away from talking about sex. That's not
our thing as I understand from our tradition.
Sex is also about building love between spouses.
37% of young Muslim adults had sex before marriage. another survey says 50% of unmarried
Muslims had sex.
50% considered it.
Muslims have higher level of self judgment. Were more critical of ourselves that everyone else.
Comment: women can't do that, but men have to have it. men have to go out and get it bc
natural but women have to remain chaste and pure.
Marriage. Consent. People make assumptions about children and drop hints that not keeping
husband happy.
Comment: If a guy sleeps he's player and girl does it she's a slut.
Comment: Guy decides to marry a virgin. Concept of virginity. Were taught to think a lot about
it.
Comment: I work at women's hospital and doctors say Muslim women come in for hymen
reconstruction surgery. virginity can be replaced and satisfies community. not experience but
physicality. one physical piece of skin. Do men have to protect it and is anyone policing it?
Comment: MUSLIM MEN NEVER GIVEN A SEX TALK. Many attendees agree. During one
attendees schooling in Saudi Arabia, she noticed that the biology textbook had the reproductive
chapter cut out.

Comment: Men explore sexuality a lot earlier than women. When women reach age, they can
become prey to men bc don't know. Only told not to do. WHAT not to do?
Ariana: We want to feel a connection and want to feel noticed. People expect that sex comes
with that connection and men or women feel need to move forward with something so sex is
seen as next step.
Touch is limited, not acceptable.
Comment: raised in Southeast Asia, problem is not sex but lack of addressing it.
Ariana: We enforce lack of closeness among selves.
Comment: We're always on defense bc were indoctrinated.
Ariana: what do separations mean? An idea people have: You're married now; everything is ok
so go after it. But in real world, these things take time. Communication cannot navigate so
easily. It's a biological process, not automatic. Vaginismus: many womens vaginas cant even
open when finally in a relationship because so much pent up tension & fear lifelong. Physical
tied to mental state. Worse, women don't address it bc failure so an otherwise very easy
solution becomes an even bigger struggle. Goes back to ridiculous standards.
Porn animalistic and fake bodies, and Muslim countries have most visitors to porn sites and
they stay a long time. Why? They can't talk about it and no one talks about it with them. These
false expectations and practices are so terrible for future relationship bc based on facade.
-Cue clicker questions: anonymous questionsquestion 2: chastity convos and open convos on sex
question 3: clitoris Q: everyone knows.
question 4: location of clitoris: every woman knows. a third of men dont.
question 5: more physical intimacy than ppl close to me know? almost exactly half.
question 6: felt guilt or shame about
question 7: 33% women. 40 something% men
q8: Most think either holding hands or sexual intercourse is farthest they'd go but pretty diverse.
q9: women and men both feel ashamed of body, not that society celebrates our bodies. almost
exactly equal!
Guilt vs shame. denial. It's not happening to our child, so we can ignore because friends child.
But then when our child is doing it, we won't talk about it and situation will go away by itself.
Zain's Q to crowd: Do I think discomfort around sexuality has had harmful effect on my own life?
Comments:

I do but can't tell anyone bc my fault since I'm a woman.

Women hear: Walk slow. Dress better.
As a nurse, I educated my child about her body parts. But bc commenter taught her daughter
and bc her daughter said it in front of pakistani/immigrant fam, Mom was seen as loose and her
daughter removed from their daughter's friend circle.
Ariana: Is this comfortable? Sex is painful if done improperly. Woman can be disrespected even
if unintentional by man just because he simply didnt ask.
Comments:
If I tell someone that a man made me uncomfortable, they ask me what I was wearing. This
happened both in my 8 years of hijab and without it, as if my clothing is source of
discomfort/threat I felt from male.
My friend experienced marital rape; blame always fell on her. It makes females not want to talk
about what happens to us.
We expect women to have more prowess. We expect Black partners to have more prowess.
Why expected to know more? Racial dynamic.
I expected wife to know what to do.
As Muslims, we haven't had sex talk bc we haven't seen some of best models. How do we know
if were a good son or wife or husband. We simply don't have those networks. A girl can
communicate to her friends about relationships at 14. Men have those conversations at 40. men
wouldn't admit their insecurities. What I'm offering is that if we can learn to comm about
husband and wife about deeper things and really learn to build that communication level where
we can talk about this and more in a very rare and raw way, then won't be talking about much
else. might lead to double life of depression and anxiety and solution is simple:
communicating is not something we want to do. do it anyway. talk about everything. Men
shouldnt say, I just went to work today. Give detail: At 6:32 am I came to consciousness. I
opened my eyes but didnt immediately get up. *laughter* Guys mega-need: commenters
advice to females is for women to be more sexual than we feel. and guys need to address
mega-need of women: communication. If we can talk about sex, we can talk about anything.
Cue community upliftment.
In desi comm, wife is taught to control her husband with access to sex. But then he finds it
outside their relationship; cue infidelity. Women find shame and guilt in certain acts of sex which
men enjoy bc associate acts with disgust from young age. But if one can maintain curiosity in
general, leads to good sex. Curiosity and communication key.

Consent means enthusiastic yes from both sides to me. Talking about sex in general is so
important.
11 yr old student in Islamic school: Myth that you get babies from sharing saliva, right?
Why is nail polish taboo? Why are girls lined up in prayer room of Islamic school acting as if can
pray, or brought into prayer room and sitting at back? Why this act just because we can't pray?
Why do we need to pretend?
Have to talk about sexual assault so girls know what people can do to their bodies - so they
know when something is not right.
Why do we need to go outside community to learn about matters related to these topics, like
sexual assault? Why are our centers out of touch?
Recently, scholars have begun to address it. Problem with our community is that we lost the
spirit of islam.
Boundaries? Where do we draw line? Is Islamic school really going to protect Muslim kids?
Commenter says no. Asks how were going to maintain kid's innocence while teaching them.
Western orientalism historically describes Muslims as too open. We were actually seen as horny
by west bc we rejected celibacy and puritanism.
Thank yous & closing!