09-23-2016 ECF 1342-1 USA V A BUNDY Et Al - Transcript of Exhibit 21

Case 3:16-cr-00051-BR
Document 1342-1
Filed 09/23/16
Page 1 of 8
TRANSCRIPTION OF THE
AUDIO-RECORDED TELEPHONE CONVERSATION
between
OPB Interviewer
and
Mr. Ryan Bundy
* * *
10
Transcriber:
Ms . Heather Fairless
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12
* * *
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www.LNScourtreporting.com
Case 3:16-cr-00051-BR
Document 1342-1
Filed 09/23/16
Transcription File: Exhibit 21
MR. BUNDY:
Page 2 of 8
2
8/12/2016
And so if they join together
to help you to push him out whether by verbal or
physical force, okay, government is born.
it the government of the lunch line.

OPB INTERVIEWER:
You can call
I know that many of my
listeners are going to be, you know, screaming at their
radios right now, saying you are talking to a guy who is
breaking the law, who has come in armed, has disrupted
people's lives, who is not even from the state of
10
Oregon.
MR. BUNDY:
11
Yeah.
Well, first of all, we
12
have not disrupted anyone's life.
13
interrupted any single person.
14
anybody's private property and according to the -OPB INTERVIEWER:
15
16
in a vacuum.
We haven't encroached on
But this didn't happen
I mean --
17
MR . BUNDY:
18
OPB INTERVIEWER:
19
I mean, we haven't
No, true.
-- the schools have
shut down.
20
MR. BUNDY:
Well
21
OPB INTERVIEWER:
And I know that there
22
are mothers who are upset that their sons are here.
23
say that lives haven't been disrupted, that is just not
24
realistic.
25
MR . BUNDY:
Granted.
To
Case 3:16-cr-00051-BR
Document 1342-1

1
OPB INTERVIEWER:
MR. BUNDY:
OPB INTERVIEWER:
Filed 09/23/16
Page 3 of 8
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8/12/2016
Okay.
Granted.
So why have militants
disrupted life at this particular facility at this
particular park?
reason for it, that the armed occupation of the refuge
was spontaneous.
But then he goes on to say something
quite different.
Here it is:
Well, at first Bundy says there is no
MR. BUNDY:
From this facility right here
10
is where the charges came from to destroy the Hammonds,
11
to throw the Hammonds in prison.
12
100 ranchers out to make this place.
13
destroying the lives and liberties and properties, you
14
know, and property rights anyway of those around .
15
being facilitated from this office.
16
it puts a stop to that.
It has taken more than

It is, you know,
So by being here,
That is another reason and
17
OPB INTERVIEWER:
18
government workers are still working from home.
19
MR. BUNDY:
20
OPB INTERVIEWER:
But the federal
Well
They are still
21
telecommuting .
22
they meet, but they are still doing the same job.
23
24
25
It is
I mean, this is just the space where
MR. BUNDY :
Well, perhaps.
You know,
this whole system isn't perfected yet.

OPB INTERVIEWER:
One of the things I
Case 3:16-cr-00051-BR
Document 1342-1
Filed 09/23/16
Page 4 of 8
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8/12/2016
noticed when I came in to this building is that ID cards
were put up for who was where in this facility.
Addresses have been pulled for who lives here.
used at all for -MR. BUNDY:
No.
Was that
In fact, you know, we
haven't touched a single personal item.
touched any of the computers.
to log on.
fact, it is kind of funny.
We haven't
We haven't used -- tried
We haven't -- we haven't done anything.
In
There is still -- anyway,
10
that is not of interest to us.
11
people.
12
people that work here.
We are not here to hurt
We are not here to hurt people, not even the
13
OPB INTERVIEWER:
14
MR. BUNDY:
Sure.
That is not our intent and so
15
no threats of any kind have gone out to anybody, any
16
individual.
OPB INTERVIEWER:
17
What is stopping you
18
from occupying the same building, same space, doing the
19
same exact thing without the weapons?
20
weapons necessary?
MR. BUNDY:
21
Why are the
Let's turn to the Second
22
Amendment.
23
being necessary to the security of a free state.
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25
What does it say?
OPB INTERVIEWER:
A well-regulated militia
Do you believe that
this is a militia?
Case 3:16-cr-00051-BR
Document 1342-1
Filed 09/23/16
MR. BUNDY:
Page 5 of 8
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8/12/2016
The right to keep and bear
arms -- or the right of the people to keep and bear
arms.
OPB INTERVIEWER:
4
5
Keep and bear arms,
yeah.
MR. BUNDY:
Okay.
You know, and quite
frankly I want to, you know -- put it this way:
not a terrorist organization.
are not trying to use extreme fear to accomplish
10
anything.
OPB INTERVIEWER:
MR. BUNDY:
seriousness.
17
Well, then why not just
Okay?
Because the lack of
You know --
OPB INTERVIEWER:
15
16
We
do all this but without the guns?
13
14
We are not terrorism.
That is not what we are here to do.
11
12
We are
The guns make the
seriousness?
MR. BUNDY:
No.
Let's go back to George
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Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin.
19
same definition that you are using to label us -- you,
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not speaking to you personally -- media, whatever -- by
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that same definition, George Washington was a terrorist.
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(End of recording.)
* * *
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By the
Case 3:16-cr-00051-BR
Document 1342-1
Filed 09/23/16
Page 6 of 8
Page 6
CERTIFICATE
I, HEATHER L. FAIRLESS, a Transcriber,
Registered Professional Reporter, Washington Certified
Court Reporter, and an Oregon Certified Shorthand
Reporter, do hereby certify that the foregoing interview
was taken down by me in stenotype from digital audio
media and transcribed through computer-aided
transcription; and that the foregoing pages constitute a
transcript prepared to the best of my ability.
10
11
Witness my hand at Portland, Oregon, this 18th

day of August, 2016.
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Heather L. Fairless
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Oregon CSR No. 10-0418
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Expires 9/30/17
18
Washington CCR No. 2842
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Expires 10/01/16
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21
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Electronically signed by Heather Fairless (601-412-541-2814)
bbe8e0e6-S94a-47e8-abc5-8da227edcdf4
Case 3:16-cr-00051-BR
Document 1342-1
Filed 09/23/16
quite 3:8 5:6
<O>
01 6: /9
<1>
10 6:/9
100 3:/ 2
10-0418 6:/6
16 6:19
17 6:/7
18th 6:/0
<D>
<K>
day 6:/ /
definition 5: 19, 21
destroy 3:10
destroying 3: 13
different 3:8
digital 6:6
disrupted 2:8, 12, 23 3:4
doing 3:22 4:/8
keep 5:1 , 2,4

kind 4:9, 15
know 2:5, 6, 21 3:12, 14,
<E>
2016 6://
2842 6:/8
encroached 2: 13
exact 4:19
Expires 6: 17, 19
extreme 5:9
<3>
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30 6:/7
facilitated 3:15
facility 3:4, 9 4:2
fact 4:5, 9
Fairless 1:10 6:2, 15
fear 5:9
federal 3:/7
first 2:11 3:5
force 2:3
foregoing 6:5, 8
Franklin 5:18
frankly 5: 7
free 4:23
funny 4:9
<2>
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9 6: / 7
<A>
1:2
back 5:17
bear 5:/ , 2, 4
believe 4:24
Benjamin 5:18
best 6:9
born 2:3
breaking 2:8
building 4:1, 18
Bundy 1:6 2:/ , 11, /7,
20, 25 3:2, 5, 9, 19, 23

4:5, 14, 21 5:/, 6, 13, 17
call 2:3
cards 4:/
CCR 6:18
CERTIFICATE 6:1
Certified 6:3, 4
certify 6:5
charges 3:10
come 2:8
computer-aided 6:7
computers 4:7
constitute 6:8
CONVERSATION 1:2
Court 6:4
CSR 6:16
23 4:5 5:6, 7, 14
<L>
label 5:/9
lack 5:13
law 2:8
liberties 3:13
life 2:12 3:4
line 2:4
listeners 2:6
lives 2:9,23 3:13 4:3
log 4:8
lunch 2:4
<M>
mean 2:12, 16 3:2 1

media 5:20 6:7
meet 3:22
militants 3:3
militia 4:22, 25
mothers 2:22
<N>
necessary 4:20, 23
noticed 4:/
< O>
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8/12/2016
WORD INDEX
ability 6:9
accomplish 5:9
Addresses 4:3
all 2:/ 1 4:4 5:12
Amendment 4:22
anybody 4:15
anybody's 2:/4
anyone's 2: / 2
anyway 3:14 4:9
armed 2:8 3:6
arms 5:2, 3, 4
audio 6:6
AUDIO-RECORDED
August 6:/ 1
Page 7 of 8
George 5:17, 21
go 5:/7
goes 3:7
going 2:6
government 2:3, 4 3:18
Granted 2:25 3:2
guns 5:/2, 15
guy 2: 7
occupation 3:6
occupying 4:18
office 3:15
okay 2:3 3: / 5:6, 14
OPB 1:4 2:5, 15,18,21
3:1 , 3, 17, 20, 25 4:13, 17,

24 5:4,ll,15
Oregon 2:10 6:4, JO, 16
organization 5:8
<H>
<P>
Hammonds 3: /0, II
hand 6:10
happen 2:15
Heather 1:10 6:2, 15
help 2:2
home 3:/8
hurt 4:10, I I
pages 6:8
park 3:5
particular 3:4, 5
people 4:1/, JI, 12 5:2
people's 2:9
perfected 3:24
person 2:/3
personal 4:6
personally 5:20
physical 2:3
place 3:12
Portland 6:10
prepared 6:9
prison 3: /J
private 2: 14
Professional 6:3
properties 3:/3
property 2:14 3: 14
pulled 4:3
push 2:2
put 4:2 5:7
puts 3: 16
<I>
ID 4:/
individual 4: 16
intent 4:14
interest 4:10
interrupted 2:13
interview 6:5
Interviewer I :4 2:5, 15,
18, 21 3:/, 3, 17, 20, 25
4:13, 17, 24 5:4, II , 15
item 4:6
<J>
Jefferson 5:18
job 3:22
join 2:/
< Q>
< R >
radios 2:7
ranchers 3: / 2
realistic 2:24
reason 3:6, 16
recording 5:22
refuge 3:6
Registered 6:3
Reporter 6:3, 4, 5
right 2:7 3:9 5:1 , 2
rights 3:14
Ryan 1:6
<S>
saying 2:7
says 3:5
schools 2: 18
screaming 2:6
Second 4:2 /
security 4:23
seriousness 5: 14, 16
Shorthand 6:4
shut 2:19
single 2:13 4:6
sons 2:22
space 3:2 1 4: 18
speaking 5:20
spontaneous 3:7
state 2:9 4:23
stenotype 6:6
stop 3:16
stopping 4:/7
Sure 4:13
system 3:24
<T>
taken 3:/l 6:6

talking 2:7
telecommuting 3:2/
TELEPHONE 1:2
terrorism 5:8
terrorist 5:8, 21
thing 4:19
things 3:25
Thomas 5:18
threats 4: 15
throw 3:/ /
touched 4:6, 7
transcribed 6:7
Transcriber 1:/0 6:2
transcript 6:9
TRANSCRIPTION I :/
6:8
tried 4: 7
true 2:17
trying 5:9
turn 4:2/
<U>
upset 2:22
use 5:9
<V>
vacuum 2:/6
verbal 2:2
Case 3:16-cr-00051-BR
Document 1342-1
Filed 09/23/16
8/12/2016
<W>
want 5:7
washington 5:/8, 2/
6:3, 18
way 5:7
weapons 4:/9, 20
Well 2:11, 20 3:5, /9, 23
5:/1
well-regulated 4:22
Witness 6:/0
work 4:/2
workers 3: / 8
working 3:18
<Y>
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09-23-2016 ECF 1342-1 USA V A BUNDY Et Al - Transcript of Exhibit 21

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09-23-2016 ECF 1342-1 USA V A BUNDY Et Al - Transcript of Exhibit 21

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Case 3:16-cr-00051-BR

AUDIO-RECORDED TELEPHONE CONVERSATION

Mr. Ryan Bundy

Transcription File: Exhibit 21

And so if they join together

to help you to push him out whether by verbal or

physical force, okay, government is born.

it the government of the lunch line.

You can call

I know that many of my

listeners are going to be, you know, screaming at their

radios right now, saying you are talking to a guy who is

breaking the law, who has come in armed, has disrupted

people's lives, who is not even from the state of

Well, first of all, we

have not disrupted anyone's life.

interrupted any single person.

anybody's private property and according to the -OPB INTERVIEWER:

But this didn't happen

And I know that there

say that lives haven't been disrupted, that is just not

Transcription File: Exhibit 21

disrupted life at this particular facility at this

reason for it, that the armed occupation of the refuge

But then he goes on to say something

Well, at first Bundy says there is no

From this facility right here

is where the charges came from to destroy the Hammonds,

to throw the Hammonds in prison.

100 ranchers out to make this place.

destroying the lives and liberties and properties, you

know, and property rights anyway of those around .

being facilitated from this office.

it puts a stop to that.

It has taken more than

That is another reason and

government workers are still working from home.

But the federal

I mean, this is just the space where

this whole system isn't perfected yet.

One of the things I

Transcription File: Exhibit 21

noticed when I came in to this building is that ID cards

were put up for who was where in this facility.

Addresses have been pulled for who lives here.

used at all for -MR. BUNDY:

In fact, you know, we

haven't touched a single personal item.

touched any of the computers.

fact, it is kind of funny.

We haven't used -- tried

We haven't -- we haven't done anything.

There is still -- anyway,

that is not of interest to us.

people that work here.

We are not here to hurt

We are not here to hurt people, not even the

That is not our intent and so

no threats of any kind have gone out to anybody, any

What is stopping you

from occupying the same building, same space, doing the

same exact thing without the weapons?

Why are the