Found signal Rotor bar pass frequency(1RBPF) high at Axial direction on Motor | AMP ...

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FOUND SIGNAL ROTOR BAR PASS FREQUENCY(1RBPF) HIGH AT AXIAL DIRECTION ON MOTOR

8 REPLIES

Found signal Rotor bar pass frequency(1RBPF) high at Axial

direction on Motor
THAWORN_B MEMBER

20/06/11 03:52 AM

From vibration measurement that we performed vibration measurement,we found high vibration at 1RBPF at axial direction
and little harmonics(2RBPF) that I can't find the root cause for this problem and other we didn't have historicalof vibration
measurement becasue we can't measure when motor is running and other we measure the vibration when motor was
disconnect form coupling and specificaton for this motor as below.(No load test)
1. NS speed= 1500 rpm
2. use VFD for control speed
3. Induction motor.
4. Speed when test run = 1378 rpm
5. Didn't found pole pass frequency around running speed and harmonics.
6. Found 1RBPF and little harmonics(see attach)
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Spectrum_for_motor.pdf

Original Post

VIBMASTER LEADER

20/06/11 05:57 AM

RBPF is common in motors. You may keep trending.

If rotor bars problem is suspected, take high resolution data and check for presence of PPF sidebands around 1X and
harmonics.
Vibmaster

THAWORN_B MEMBER

21/06/11 03:10 AM

Can I accept this overall vibration? Because overall vibration on axail direction is 5.08 mm/s rms and 1RBPF peak is 3.9
mm/s rms.

VIBMASTER LEADER

21/06/11 09:02 AM

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Found signal Rotor bar pass frequency(1RBPF) high at Axial direction on Motor | AMP ... Page 2 of 4

Are you sure, it is at no load?

Any soft foot/ rotor eccentricity?
Vibmaster

ELECTRICPETE LEADER

21/06/11 03:42 PM

I agree with the good comments from Vibmaster.

I would generally not be concerned about the RBPF +/- 2*LF pattern unless there is something else you see (like unusual
increasing trend, pole pass sidebands, etc).

That pattern often is present to varying degrees in healthy motors, simply a consequence of their design (for example
certain combination of rotor bar numbers and stator slot numbers create high RBPF pattern vibration). It can change under
load, generally goes up with load, although Jan has posted one example very high RBPF at no load... all bars
removed.....simply a function of machine design. The level can also change as a result of similar things that affect 2*LF
vibration (airgap, voltage level, voltage balance, machine support).

Experience teaches us we should worry about machines based on housing velocity levels. I would suggest RBPF is one
exception to the rule. Most likely the bulk of thesee forces are not transmitted through the bearings, but are transmitted
directly between the deforming stator core and stator frame and then to the bearing housings.... they do not represent a load
on the bearings.

RALPH STEWART LEADER

21/06/11 05:12 PM

quote:
we didn't have historicalof vibration measurement becasue we can't measure when motor is running and other we
measure the vibration when motor was disconnect form coupling and specificaton for this motor as below.(No load
test)

I may be reading the above quote incorrectly but are you saying,,, You can not measure the vibration when the motor is
running connected to the driven machine? ("becasue we can't measure when motor is running"). Is this because the motor is
in the shop rather than at the normal running position, driving something?

Then you disconnect the coupling in order to take data on the motor? ("we measure the vibration when motor was
disconnect form coupling")

Sorry for misunderstanding.

THAWORN_B MEMBER

22/06/11 06:44 AM

This motor is equipment of Ship unloader that was removed for overhaul and after overhaul finished this motor was installed
at old position on ship unloader and test run by uncoupling that was performed vibration measurement(is n't work
shop).Usually we can't measure for vibration when ship unloader is operating because is n't safe that was performed the
vibration measurement 1 time when this motor was overhual and uncoupling only(This motor drive sling for braket open and
close).Now we have performed motor current analysis at 30% load that didn't found any problem such as rotor bar

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Found signal Rotor bar pass frequency(1RBPF) high at Axial direction on Motor | AMP ... Page 3 of 4

crack,loose,phase balance,open rotor bar and other problem of electrical.From vibration measurement found 1RBPF only
that highest of frequency on spectrum and at axial direction about 3.5 mm/s rms on 1RBPF that radial is lower than and
didn't found signal bearing defect or unbalance.Please give me the consultant for this problem.
Thank you so much
Thaworn_b
Pdm Engineer

KUCHO MEMBER

22/05/13 06:19 AM *

And finaly it was a problem of.........??????

Ive a Motor the same of you, 1AX=8mm/s RMS totaly at RBP 44X with few RBP+/-2xLF, in load after changing coupling
shims and realign.
The motor always has this signature but 2mm/s. I Think is a soft foot, we will check tomorrow.

The 1 axial was high only in one foot near to de screw, the point 2Ax was 2mm/s

We open the motor and it was 40x rotor bar. The bearings were OK, and visual inspection of rotor bar and stator slots was
ok.Only I saw too much red paint particles flying inside the motor.

Monday starts
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RN CM MEMBER

24/05/13 12:30 PM

With rotor bar I have been taught to watch for the 2x RBPF with sidebands of 2X LF. When the 2X RBPF exceeds 0.1 ips its a
pretty severe condition. Otherwise you will drive yuorself crazy, the 1X RBP varies in amplitude by load. I have limited
experience but work with 3 other very experienced analyst and have seen RBP change due to loading.

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HOME MAINTENANCEFORUMS ASSET CONDITION MANAGEMENT POSTS ABOUT VIBRATION/ALIGNMENT/BALANCE

FOUND SIGNAL ROTOR BAR PASS FREQUENCY(1RBPF) HIGH AT AXIAL DIRECTION ON MOTOR

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