605 Sentencing of Schaeffer Cox Transcript

1 UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
2 FOR THE DISTRICT OF ALASKA
3 UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, ) Case 3:11-cr-00022-01-RJB

)
4 Plaintiff, ) Anchorage, Alaska
) Tuesday, January 8, 2013
5 vs. ) 9:27 o'clock a.m.
)
6 FRANCIS SCHAEFFER COX, )
)
7 Defendant. )
) IMPOSITION OF SENTENCE
8
TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS
9
BEFORE THE HONORABLE ROBERT J. BRYAN
10 UNITED STATES DISTRICT JUDGE
11 APPEARANCES:
12 For the Plaintiff: STEVEN E. SKROCKI

YVONNE LAMOUREUX
13 Assistant U.S. Attorneys
Office of the U.S. Attorney
14 222 West 7th Avenue, #9, Room 253
Anchorage, Alaska 99513-7567
15 (907) 271-5071
16 For the Defendant: PETER A. CAMIEL

Mair & Camiel
17 710 Cherry Street
Seattle, Washington 98104
18 (206) 624-1551
19 Probation Officer: CHARLENE HENSEL

U.S. Probation/Pretrial Services
20 222 West 7th Avenue, Box 48, Room 168
21 (907) 271-5492
22 Court Recorder: DENALI ELMORE

U.S. District Court
23 222 West 7th Avenue, #4, Room 229
24 (907) 677-6123
25
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Case 3:11-cr-00022-RJB Document 605 Filed 03/27/13 Page 1 of 72
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1 ANCHORAGE, ALASKA - TUESDAY, JANUARY 8, 2013
3 (Call to Order of the Court at 9:27 a.m.)
4 (Defendant present)
5 THE CLERK: All rise. His Honor the Court, the United
6 States District Court for the District of Alaska is now in
7 session, the Honorable Robert J. Bryan presiding.
8 THE COURT: Please be seated. Good morning.
9 MR. SKROCKI: Good morning, Your Honor.
10 MS. LAMOUREUX: Good morning, Your Honor.
11 MR. CAMIEL: Morning, Your Honor.
12 THE COURT: This is cause number 11-22, United States
13 versus Francis Schaeffer Cox. Mr. Cox is present in court with
14 his attorney, Mr. Camiel. The government is here in the person
15 of Mr. Skrocki and Ms. Lamoureux. And the matter comes on for
16 sentencing for the counts of conviction in the jury's verdict.
17 Mr. Cox, the first thing I must do is ask you if you
18 have received and read the presentence report and sentencing
19 recommendation from the probation officer.
20 THE DEFENDANT: Yes, I have, Your Honor.
21 THE COURT: And have you had the opportunity to discuss
22 those documents with Mr. Camiel?
23 THE DEFENDANT: Yes, I have.
24 THE COURT: Okay. Now, the first thing that we have to
25 do in this sentencing, as in any other, is to determine the
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1 application of the guidelines. And I know there are a lot of
2 people here today interested in this matter. And the guideline
3 issues are sometimes somewhat tedious, but we have to go
4 through this and determine what the guidelines are before we
5 can turn to -- turn our attention to the actual sentencing
6 process.
7 And in this case there have been filed a number of
8 objections to the guideline workup and to the presentence
9 report that the Court must resolve. I guess, first, the
10 objections filed really are in two categories. One is
11 regarding the factual statements made in the presentence report
12 and whether any of those should be omitted or changed or added
13 to. The second types of objections are to the application of
14 guideline workup. And I guess my first question to Mr. Camiel,
15 these are your -- well, maybe I should ask the government
16 first. I take it you have no objections to the probation
17 officer's report and guideline workup?
18 MR. SKROCKI: That's correct, we have no objection.
19 THE COURT: All right. And, Mr. Camiel, I guess that
20 puts the ball in your court in regard to the various objections
21 that you have made. And I don't know how you anticipate
22 proceeding on this. Do you want to be heard on the various
23 issues raised regarding the factual content of the presentence
24 report, or do you want me to just rule on that stuff?
25 MR. CAMIEL: Your Honor, as to the factual objections
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1 that don't affect the guidelines, I think we adequately
2 addressed that in our written submission, and so we're prepared
3 to have the Court just rule on those.
4 THE COURT: Okay. Well, I should say that I've read
5 everything filed, including all the letters and briefs and
6 everything that's been filed in this case, and of course also
7 recall the events of the trial.
8 Now, in regard to objections to the content of the
9 factual statements in the presentence report, I think it is not
10 necessary or appropriate for me to rewrite that in any general
11 way, which is sort of suggested by the volume of the objections
12 made. And some of the objections were already dealt with, and
13 the others -- I'm looking at my notes here, counsel, to see if
14 there was anything here that I felt should be changed on the
15 basis of the objections made.
16 Okay, just give me another couple of seconds to look at
17 this. I think the ones that I left open and have questions are
18 all matters relating to application of the guidelines. And
19 that does seem to be the case.
20 The bottom line is that on the objections to the
21 factual contents of the presentence report, I think that none
22 of those objections merit a change to the presentence report.
23 Certainly those objections are part of the record in the case
24 and reflect in large part the defendant's view of the facts in
25 the case. And I think the statements as made in the objections
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1 is sufficient without changing the presentence report.
2 So let's turn our attention to guidelines issues. And
3 sorry to take time looking at stuff here. The volume of
4 paperwork is terrific here. I guess the first question is
5 whether there's any objection to the grouping that the
6 probation officer did, that is, grouping Counts 1 through 6 and
7 10 into one group for guideline computation, and then a second
8 group of Counts 12 and 16.
9 MR. CAMIEL: Not from the defense, Your Honor.
10 THE COURT: I think --
11 MR. SKROCKI: No, sir.
12 THE COURT: I think that was appropriate -- an
13 appropriate division. So that's fine.
14 I guess if we should go by the order these things are
15 raised in the defense memorandum, that would bring us to the
16 question of paragraph 135 of the presentence report and the
17 four-level enhancement the probation officer made under
18 2K2.1(b)(6) regarding firearms being used in connection with
19 another felony offense. And so I guess, Mr. Camiel, if you
20 wish to address that.
21 MR. CAMIEL: Well, Your Honor, the only comments I
22 would have about that are, first of all, the 924(c) counts,
23 which charged the possession, carrying a firearm during or in
24 furtherance of a crime of violence. The firearm possession in
25 this case -- there were certainly firearms possessed at many
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1 times. But because of the nature of the conspiracy that was
2 charged, I'm not sure that it could be said that there were
3 firearms possessed in connection with another felony offense.
4 I'm not sure what that other felony offense was or what
5 specific dates being talked about. And I would just point that
6 out and stand otherwise on our written submission.
7 THE COURT: Mr. Skrocki, on that issue?
8 MR. SKROCKI: Yes, briefly, Your Honor.
9 THE COURT: I want to take these one at a time and I'll
10 rule on them one at a time.
11 MR. SKROCKI: Certainly. This enhancement was applied
12 to Mr. Barney. The facts and the circumstances are similar in
13 this case. It was very clear from the facts at the trial, as
14 established in the presentence report, that the possession of
15 these items was used in furtherance of -- and would have been
16 used, as to Counts 12 and 16. I mean, I think the facts are
17 really beyond dispute with respect to this.
18 THE COURT: Well, I think the probation officer was
19 right in that regard. And we'll make no change in that
20 application.
21 The next one raised was the status of the intended
22 victims as government employees, in paragraph 142, and is the
23 official victims issue. Mr. Camiel, anything on that?
24 MR. CAMIEL: Your Honor, the -- just to clarify, you
25 know, my argument about this, there's no dispute that the base
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1 offense level in this case is 33, based on Section 2A1.5 of the
2 guidelines. I've argued that adding another six levels because
3 these -- the -- of the status of the victims is in this case
4 double counting. And the reason for that is in this case I
5 believe that the base offense level already takes into account
6 the status of the intended victims.
7 And if you look at -- if you actually go back and look
8 at 2A1.5, that guideline, it refers you back to the statute
9 under which Mr. Cox was charged in Count 12, 18 United States
10 Code, Section 1117. And that's the conspiracy to commit murder
11 statute. And that statute specifically incorporates 18 United
12 States Code, Section 1114, which is the murder of an official
13 victim.
14 There are two ways that somebody gets charged with
15 conspiracy to commit murder, again, in the federal
16 jurisdiction, and one is if the intended victim is a govern --
17 a federal government official, and the other is if the crime
18 takes place on -- within federal jurisdiction, on federal land.
19 And Mr. Cox was charged under 1114, the nature of the intended
20 victim.
21 This is a big enhancement. It's a six-level
22 enhancement. It drives it from 33 to 39. And I believe that
23 because 2A1.5 refers back to the statute under which he was
24 charged and that statute refers specifically to the official
25 victim statute, that it's double counting. Now, I recognize
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1 that the government has cited to the Court a number of cases
2 that hold otherwise, but none of those are Ninth Circuit cases.
3 I don't know that this has been addressed specifically in the
4 Ninth Circuit.
5 But the way the government charged the case -- and the
6 jury was required as a part of its findings, as one of the
7 elements, to find that the intended victims were official
8 victims, I think that in this case the base offense already
9 incorporates the status of the victim because of the reference
10 back to that particular statute. So in this case it would be
11 improper double counting.
12 THE COURT: Okay.
13 MR. SKROCKI: Briefly, Your Honor. We would rely on
14 the authorities provided in our sentencing memo. There's no
15 reason why they would have no application here. Frankly, the
16 Talley case, as we cited, seems to be on point or directly on
17 point with respect to this enhancement, so we believe that that
18 enhancement's appropriate.
19 THE COURT: Well, let me tell you how I view this. The
20 statute of conviction does carry with it and the jury
21 instructions carry with it as part of the elements that it be a
22 public official or a federal official. That, it seems to me,
23 is entirely different than figuring out what guidelines apply
24 to that offense. And the guidelines fix a base offense level
25 33 for any conspiracy or solicitation to commit murder. The
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1 guideline does not contemplate that the victims be federal
2 officials. That comes with the addition under 3A1.2(b) and
3 that increases that guideline by six levels, which is a -- as
4 you indicated, is a large increase. But nevertheless, I think
5 that is how the guidelines should be read.
6 And the guidelines are a separate analysis, I think,
7 from the conviction. You have to take the conviction and
8 figure out what -- not what elements were in the offense of
9 conviction, but how those elements might apply to the
10 guidelines or the guidelines apply to those elements. And I
11 think that six-level enhancement is appropriate.
12 Now, the next one is an objection to paragraph 144
13 regarding use of body armor.
14 MR. CAMIEL: Your Honor, the -- just to clarify my
15 objection there, it -- because the -- I don't think the
16 guideline is -- at least not to me -- particularly clear when
17 you're dealing with a conspiracy. It's an ongoing long-term
18 charged offense, as opposed to a substantive crime where you
19 could say during the bank robbery you were wearing body armor.
20 And I think that in this case the body armor
21 enhancement rightfully applies to the substantive offenses, but
22 not to the conspiracy or the solicitation offenses, which
23 encompass a much longer period of time and I think make it much
24 harder for the Court to say that he was using the body armor --
25 the guideline uses the term "use" or "used" -- to commit that
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1 or to enhance or somehow to facilitate that offense. So that's
2 a distinction I would make, is yes, it applies to the
3 substantive counts, but not to Counts 12 and 16.
4 MR. SKROCKI: Your Honor, Mr. Barney received a similar
5 adjustment in his case, which is certainly a concrete reason to
6 apply it here. But the facts are still the same with respect
7 to Mr. Cox. The guideline says use the body armor in
8 preparation for an offense or in an attempt to avoid
9 apprehension in a crime of violence, which is then further
10 defined as a substantial risk that physical force against the
11 person or property of another may be used. And the facts of
12 this case clearly establish the application of that guideline
13 to the use of body armor, not only for Mr. Cox, certainly, but
14 the rest of the members of the security detail as well as
15 for -- you know, for the solicitation count and for the
16 conspiracy count, use body armor as well, fully knowing that --
17 and expecting contact with law enforcement or federal agents.
18 And additionally, it could have been contact with any law
19 enforcement officer, which is why this guideline applies.
20 THE COURT: Let me take a minute to reread that section
21 of the guidelines. (Pause) Well, I'm no fan of these
22 guidelines, but nevertheless, they must be read and applied as
23 they are and they must be applied to the evidence in the case.
24 And Section 3B1.5 indicates that if the defendant used body
25 armor during the commission of the offense, that is, of a crime
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1 of violence, increase by four levels.
2 I think the evidence in the case indicated strongly
3 that Mr. Cox wore body armor a great deal during the time
4 involved in these offenses, including the time involved in both
5 the weapons charges and the more serious charges in Count 12
6 and 16. I think that applies.
7 And the last objection, I believe, is the one regarding
8 the obstruction of justice. And that is based on Mr. Cox's
9 testimony primarily, as I understand the presentence report.
10 And as to that, Mr. Camiel.
11 MR. CAMIEL: Your Honor had to deal with this same
12 objection with Mr. Barney's sentencing and decided, I believe,
13 not to apply it in his case. And I -- this has come up in
14 other cases I've had and I've always seen trial judges struggle
15 with this, where they have a defendant who testifies to a
16 version of events and the jury convicts. And the government
17 argues that based on that, a person obstructed and committed
18 perjury.
19 Mr. Cox's testimony certainly was inconsistent with
20 other evidence that was presented at trial in some respects.
21 Some of the things that the government says were perjurious I
22 think came to what Mr. Cox believed or perceived at the time
23 things were going on or remembered. And I don't think it can
24 be said that just because a jury comes back with a conviction
25 that there was willful obstruction, willful perjury.
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1 In Mr. Cox's case in particular, because of what we
2 know now about him -- and we'll get to this -- but in terms of
3 the -- his mental health issues, I think it's even more
4 difficult to state that he was willfully perjuring himself or
5 obstructing. Because I think that the way he perceived the
6 world and his understanding of what was going on around him was
7 to a large degree affected by mental health issues. So I would
8 suggest to the Court that there simply isn't enough to say that
9 he committed an obstruction.
10 And it has to not only be willful, that it has to be
11 something that was material to the charge. And their --
12 government cites a long list of things that they say were
13 inaccurate in his testimony. But I think that a fair measure
14 of those could be argued not to have been material to the jury
15 verdict or to the actual charges. They were collateral to
16 that. So I would argue and urge the Court not to impose that
17 adjustment.
18 MR. SKROCKI: Your Honor sat through the trial of this
19 case and watched Mr. Cox testify in that jury -- or in that
20 witness box in front of the jury for probably close to two
21 days, if I recall correctly. In the government's estimation,
22 the degree of obstruction and perjury was stunning.
23 Mr. Camiel has referenced the report he's provided to
24 you, which we seek to address to you in open court, since it
25 was filed under seal, at some point, maybe not right now. None
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1 of that information in there rises to the level of claiming
2 that Mr. Cox's testimony was somehow not perjurious. For
3 example, Your Honor had before you the recordings in the
4 investigation where Mr. Cox says he has a fully-automatic STEN
5 machine gun. Let's just take that one example. As he sat
6 there in the box and looked at the jury, he said, "No, that
7 never worked for me. The FBI manufactured the test. It was
8 just a -- it was just a World War II relic, it was kind of
9 fun." But that's one concrete example.
10 The example -- further examples of "I didn't want any
11 silencers, I didn't want any hand grenades," are totally
12 contradicted by the investigative information in Mr. Cox's own
13 words, where he's -- and frankly, Your Honor, this is sort of
14 part of our sentencing pitch -- is his idea for grenades, it
15 came from Mr. Cox. The idea to go get grenades at the militia
16 convention in February came from him. The bartering of
17 silencers and grenades for his fully-automatic machine gun came
18 from him. The possession and the creation and manufacture of
19 that silencer, which is continually described as a garden hose,
20 was manufactured by him. It required a metal insertion that
21 required machining to get it done right. He informed Mr. Olson
22 and Mr. Barney during the recorded conversations of his -- in
23 the intricate knowledge of how silencers worked and his -- and
24 essentially held a tutoring school as to how they worked. But
25 when it comes to telling the jury that, you know, this is just
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1 a big mistake.
2 Sometimes, Your Honor, perjury can come in small pieces
3 that really affect the big picture. As I've mentioned in
4 closing, if you might recall, and I won't go through all of the
5 examples, but with respect to some of the things found in Mr.
6 Cox's home, continually blame shifts, avoids responsibility for
7 them, and stated to the jury that somebody else left them
8 there.
9 Remember those DVDs with the instructions to convert
10 all sorts of weapons to fully automatic -- those two DVDs were
11 left there by somebody else. With respect to the silencer, he
12 thought he didn't have to register it. With respect to the
13 machine gun -- another example, he blamed ATF, "I got the wrong
14 advice from ATF." So I don't need to go through the whole
15 trial for you, Your Honor, but I think the evidence here is
16 overwhelming. Unless you have any further questions on
17 details, that's all I have.
18 THE COURT: Well, this -- applying this guideline of
19 obstruction of justice to a defendant's testimony is in my
20 view -- and as I've said before, is a very slippery slope. And
21 the -- there are a couple of reasons for it. One is -- a
22 couple of reasons that it's a slippery slope is that it -- it's
23 a conflict between freedom of speech and the obligation to tell
24 the truth. And defendants have the right to tell their stories
25 as they see their stories. They don't have a right to lie.
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1 The other reason that this is something of a slippery
2 slope is that it -- when obstruction is based on perjury it
3 puts the Court in the position of making a finding that should
4 be based on evidence beyond a reasonable doubt, convincing
5 beyond a reasonable doubt of the commission of another crime,
6 that is, perjury. And it is not appropriate for the Court to
7 say, "Well, I think he lied, therefore this should apply.
8 There's more to it than that."
9 I have some doubts in my mind at this point as to the
10 willfulness of Mr. Cox's untruths. We know he told many
11 consistent -- consistently, from the beginning of this
12 investigation through the trial. But I have some doubts in my
13 mind about that and I think doubts need to be resolved in favor
14 of a defendant. Those things can well be considered by the
15 Court in determining that the sentence should be without this
16 particular enhancement in the guidelines. And I will simply
17 not apply that obstruction count. And I think that was all of
18 the issues -- or that -- I should say obstruction enhancement.
19 I think that's all the issues that you raised regarding
20 guideline applications, is it not, Mr. Camiel?
21 MR. CAMIEL: Your Honor, I had raised the role issue,
22 and I --
23 THE COURT: Yeah. Okay.
24 MR. CAMIEL: I don't have a lot to say about that. I
25 had argued that I think he ought to get a two-level enhancement
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1 rather than four. I think in Mr. Cox's own mind he saw himself
2 as a leader, but I'm not sure how many people he actually led
3 to do anything. I think that Mr. Vernon was on his own track.
4 As the government says in their memorandum, he had his own
5 demons and anger about things unrelated to Mr. Cox.
6 The one incident where there were several people
7 involved was this KJNP incident, and I'm not sure that the jury
8 found that that was really criminal conduct. At least one of
9 the jurors indicated to the Court that they didn't. And I'm
10 not sure that, if you take that out of the equation, Mr. Cox
11 had a leadership role over many people at all -- probably Mr.
12 Barney to some degree. But beyond that, I'm not sure there was
13 much else under his control or management, although in his mind
14 he may have thought there was a lot more to his persuasive
15 abilities.
16 THE COURT: What paragraph was that in the presentence
17 report?
18 MR. SKROCKI: 143.
19 THE COURT: Let me take a look at what the probation
20 officer wrote about that. (Pause) Okay. Further on that, Mr.
21 Skrocki?
22 MR. SKROCKI: Just briefly, Your Honor. With respect
23 to the KJNP detail, certainly we have five participants in the
24 form of Mr. Barney, Mr. Vernon, Mr. Thesing, Mr. Brockman, and
25 one other unidentified individual who was doing point for the
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1 surveillance team at the entrance of KJNP. Additionally
2 throughout the course of the -- of this conspiracy you can
3 include Michael Anderson with respect to the conspiracy to
4 murder federal officials, which in fact occurred before even
5 the KJNP incident. So adding him to the mix would give you six
6 individuals. And so most certainly this application, as we
7 mentioned in our memo, applies to this.
8 THE COURT: I am sure that 3B1.1, the aggravating role
9 guideline, and subsection (c) of that guideline applies. I am
10 not satisfied that the jury necessarily found that there were
11 five or more participants in regard to the -- to Counts 12 and
12 16. And I think those doubts go in favor of the defendant, and
13 I would find that his role in the offense under the guidelines
14 for Counts 12 and 16 is a 2 enhancement rather than a 4.
15 Now let me see what that comes out to. Under the first
16 group of offenses, Counts 1 through 6 and 10, I believe that
17 comes to a net 34 offense level, which is an 18 base, four-
18 level enhancement for the number of guns involved, two-level
19 enhancement for destructive device being involved, a four-level
20 increase for weapons being used in connection with a felony,
21 two-level increase for the role in the offense, four-level
22 increase regarding the body armor, and no two-level increase
23 for obstruction. And let me add and be sure I have these
24 numbers right. I believe that comes to a 34 offense level.
25 Under Counts 12 and 16, the base offense level is 33
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1 with a six-point enhancement for a federal victim. Role in the
2 offense would add two. And the body armor enhancement four
3 points, and that would be all, with no obstruction, which leads
4 to 33 -- a 45 offense level.
5 Now, based on the findings I've made, are you in
6 agreement with those calculations?
7 MR. SKROCKI: Yes, Your Honor.
8 MR. CAMIEL: Yes, Your Honor.
9 THE COURT: Now, as to grouping, I -- if I understand
10 that, the grouping rules, that would make the offense level for
11 the guidelines the higher of those two numbers, of 45.
12 MR. SKROCKI: We agree.
13 THE COURT: All right. And that is my finding, this is
14 an offense level 45.
15 Now, the criminal history, it appears clear from the
16 presentence report that he is charged with one point for the
17 prior offense and a second point for -- because these events --
18 these offenses occurred while he was technically on probation
19 for that first offense, which would result in a history
20 category of 2. Arguably, that overstates his criminal history
21 category, but I think it's a 2. Am I right?
22 MR. SKROCKI: We agree with that calculation.
23 THE COURT: You agree. All right. And the
24 guideline -- there's no range. The guideline is life in
25 prison.
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1 All right. Having resolved those issues, let's turn
2 our attention to disposition here. Mr. Skrocki or Ms.
3 Lamoureux, whoever speaks for the government, if you'd go
4 first.
5 MR. SKROCKI: Your Honor, Mr. Camiel filed a sentencing
6 memo and the report that he had done under seal. I would
7 request permission to speak about it in open court.
8 MR. CAMIEL: I think that's necessary, and I don't
9 object.
10 THE COURT: All right.
11 MR. SKROCKI: As you know, Judge, under the 3553
12 factors, you have an amalgamation of things to consider. And I
13 think in this case the most important things to consider are
14 issues of safety of the community, deterrence, the background
15 of Mr. Cox, and the very real threat that he posed to the
16 citizens of the community.
17 With respect to this case, you know, at the last minute
18 we get a report -- we don't have a witness here to talk about
19 it. We don't have what this report was based on save for some
20 vague references to information provided by Mr. Cox and Mr.
21 Camiel and maybe opening statements and some other things. But
22 we don't know whether this person listed -- listened to all of
23 the recordings in the case, listened to Mr. Cox's trial
24 testimony or any other trial testimony, for that matter.
25 Nobody certainly contacted our office to get any other
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1 information. Whether the investigative reports were read, we
2 just don't know.
3 Given that, our position is that report at this stage
4 is essentially not worth very much. It might provide some
5 information as to the background, but in terms of the
6 sentencing matrix here, it's not something that can be relied
7 upon except for a couple of things which I'll talk about in a
8 minute.
9 Claiming paranoid schizophrenia, delusional personality
10 disorder, and paranoid personality disorder is just another
11 building block in Mr. Cox's continual denial of responsibility
12 for his actions. And that's one thing that I think is very
13 clear in this case, is that Your Honor has seen, as you
14 mentioned, 4,000 defendants come through your courtroom.
15 You've probably been doing this twice as long, if not longer,
16 than I have.
17 A lot of times defendants come in here and they are
18 penitent, they come with a certain degree of remorse, sometimes
19 more, sometimes less. But if you take a step back, Your Honor,
20 and you look at Mr. Cox's actions on the stand, in his
21 sentencing memos and in these letters, if you take a step back
22 and look at them, there is a concerted amalgamation of
23 information here to deny responsibility.
24 The letters work in conjunction with the report. The
25 report goes to the extent of blaming others for Mr. Cox's
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1 actions. One of their witnesses who came in here, Hal Hume,
2 older gentleman, retired state trooper, he provided a letter in
3 support for Mr. Cox. He's the one to blame for Mr. Cox's
4 predicament. He's one of these older gentlemen that led Mr.
5 Cox down the path that led him to where he sits here today.
6 And if -- you've seen Mr. Cox's speeches, you've
7 listened to him, you saw him testify. And the report has,
8 frankly, Your Honor, the audacity of saying that Mr. Cox is not
9 intelligent and he's not a leader and he's not capable of doing
10 the things that he's done, based on we don't know how long of a
11 conversation. And, frankly, it is audacious to submit that.
12 Because this man is intelligent and the person he portrays for
13 you here today about the one who wants to leave the state,
14 blaming everybody else for his problems, is not somebody that
15 you should be taking a significant degree of leniency with.
16 So let's take a look at what he's done, Judge, and I --
17 and I'm going to go on here for a little bit. I don't usually
18 do this in sentencing, but this one's important and there's a
19 lot to talk about. What is he saying to you? He's saying, you
20 know, "The things that I said, I got from other people."
21 That's totally contradicted by the trial evidence.
22 Mr. Clark came in here and said, you know, "We had this
23 group of older gentlemen. Everybody told Mr. Cox, 'You're
24 going down the wrong path.'" Right. So that's contradicted.
25 Mr. Hume came in here and said, "You're going down the
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1 wrong path." They called Steve Cooper. Mr. Cooper might have
2 been on -- in the courtroom longer than Your Honor has. He's
3 been around a long time, 35-plus, 40 years. Mr. Cox sought his
4 counsel. And he came in here and testified and said, "Stick to
5 your guns on the Second Amendment, don't go down this militia
6 path." He sought his counsel out twice. And instead of
7 listening to it, he ignored it.
8 And he's coming here before you today with these
9 reports and these letters, saying these other gentlemen are to
10 blame. You don't hear any of that in the recordings. You
11 didn't hear any of that on the stand. Sort of like -- it's
12 sort of like the game Whack-A-Mole. You know, the thing pops
13 up and you hit it down. Every time an issue comes up, he's got
14 to have a way to knock that issue down. So in terms of
15 leadership, "That's not my fault. And if I said these things
16 that were not my fault and I acted on them, they not only were
17 not my fault, but I didn't mean to do it."
18 Now, there's a lot of kernels of evidence that
19 establish that he did mean to do this, and he wasn't flippant,
20 and he was a leader. And he was running these people in his
21 group down the road. And as we've -- you know, everybody
22 says -- you know, we've said the same thing -- at some point
23 they were going to do it. But when did it in his mind start?
24 You know, before he met J.R. Olson, for sure. And why
25 is that? He built a silencer before he met Olson, he had
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1 grenades before he met Olson, he had the STEN before he met
2 Olson. He talked to Anderson about killing people before he
3 met Olson. He talked to Mike Anderson about killing people who
4 were family friends of his before he ever met J.R. Olson.
5 Now, you've seen emails that we -- email traffic
6 between our office and the FBI. You know, out of a lot of
7 emails, some taken out of context, but some saying, hey, look,
8 you know, no doubt, you can't have an informant saying, "How
9 about 5-4-1." Right? But Mr. Cox doesn't say in here, "You
10 know, I was -- I listened to those guys and I made some bad
11 decisions about what my actions were." But instead he's --
12 what does he do now? He's blaming the government, he's blaming
13 Olson, he's blaming Aaron Bennett, he's blaming Bill Fulton.
14 Was any of this, these excuses he's giving you here
15 today, established by the recordings in this case? Do you ever
16 hear him say, at critical times for KJNP, for example, or when
17 he's meeting about "When am I going to leave the state," that
18 "I'm worried about Bill Fulton," that "I'm worried about Aaron
19 Bennett. I'm worried about these guys coming to kill me," with
20 reference to those individuals? There's nothing there.
21 The one point, Your Honor, that we have to make in
22 terms of Mr. Cox saying, you know, "Hey, I just wanted to take
23 care of my family and leave Alaska." Well, what does he say
24 with respect to that? What's the tag-on line at the end? "And
25 then I'm going to come back and I'm going to wage guerilla
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25
1 warfare."
2 This is not the type of individual who's before you who
3 is really accepting any kind of responsibility. And that's one
4 of the factors you have to take into account here. This is
5 just another example of a master manipulator. Because that's
6 what's going on. It's a master manipulator that you've got
7 here, that will change his perspective, change his argument to
8 fit any circumstance.
9 But six weeks of trial, Judge, washes that all away.
10 The jury's convictions in this case wash all that away. They
11 heard him, they looked at him. He sat there 12 feet way and he
12 discounted everything that he had to say in terms of his
13 excuses. And all of these excuses have just come up in -- with
14 respect to that report.
15 Frankly, had anybody, we submit, suggested that to Mr.
16 Cox ahead of time, years ago, it would have been met with
17 renunciation. It wouldn't have been something Mr. Cox would
18 have been interested in doing.
19 And so what else, Your Honor -- we'll be asking you for
20 a long sentence. And to some that might be shocking and
21 disturbing. And I can tell you that our office makes that
22 recommendation without -- with a lot of deliberation. It was
23 not something that we came upon in a vacuum and just threw out
24 there. It was the result of a lot of deliberation.
25 And the reason for that is that, you know, Mr. Cox used
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1 the facade of his militia to threaten judges, to threaten law
2 enforcement. Mr. Wall, for example, was visited at his home --
3 which you know is one of those things that in that line of work
4 crosses the line -- while Mr. Cox is wearing body armor. He
5 threatened war against state court judges, attempted to sue
6 people who aggrieved him.
7 And so, really, at the end of the day, you mentioned,
8 Judge, that this case was not about First Amendment, it's not
9 about the militia. It's about him. And it's about him using
10 the facade and the strength and the power, and, frankly, the
11 terror of the unknown of what -- what or who, like Lonnie
12 Vernon, might be sitting behind his militia to carry out his
13 threat.
14 He's here before you now saying that, "Well, what I
15 mean by these people coming in to do bad things is Bill Fulton
16 and J.R. Olson and maybe Aaron Bennett." But that's not
17 something you ever hear, ever, in the course of that
18 investigation. And Mr. Olson was in there almost every day.
19 So the record on that is pretty clear.
20 But none of these things that you're -- here before you
21 now is a basis for a sentence of 10 years or a sentence of 20
22 years. And had we known about this, we submit, ahead of time,
23 it wouldn't have made any difference in our recommendation,
24 because we submitted this -- it's fallacy. And it's not --
25 certainly not accurate enough or in depth enough for you to
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27
1 make a finding on that he should get a departure.
2 So we're not here asking you for life, but we're asking
3 for a very long sentence. And why is that? You know, Mr.
4 Cox's trouble with the legal system makes him different than
5 Mr. Barney. You know, you've got a range in this case of five
6 years for Mr. Barney, 12 for Mrs. Vernon, 25 for Lonnie Vernon.
7 And certainly there's a difference in Mr. Cox and Mr. Vernon as
8 to the ultimate objective.
9 We all know Mr. Vernon's objective was to murder Judge
10 Beistline and members of his family. There were hand-drawn
11 maps found in his car along with ammunition and everything
12 else. And Mrs. Vernon says, "These'll do the job, right?" But
13 you know that Mr. Vernon was a foot soldier for Mr. Cox.
14 Mr. Cox blames the government for virtually everything
15 in this case, including sentencing entrapment, which is
16 something that was pulled out of an email I sent to my
17 management because I didn't have time to research, and it was a
18 concern. It doesn't apply in this case. And the reason it
19 doesn't apply in this case in terms of the grenades and
20 silencers is Mr. Cox was predisposed to have them. That's
21 clearly established from the evidence in this case. He sent
22 Mr. Olson and Mr. Vernon down in February of 2010 to go to the
23 militia convention to obtain hand grenades.
24 And what's important, Your Honor, in this case and in
25 sentencing and in considering all these points, is that what
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1 did Mr. Cox say with respect to those grenades? He tells you,
2 "I know how to make them operable." He says, "I have two-
3 second ALS fuses," which he does. And he says, "I want to have
4 stronger powder, to make the shrapnel really fly."
5 This is not something he got from Hal Hume. This is
6 not something he got from J.R. Olson. It's not information he
7 received from anybody but himself. And you know that because
8 the CDs found in his home have stuff on there in terms of how
9 to make these things. His own computer searches -- a critical
10 piece, his search of his computer. What's he looking for on
11 YouTube? Ammonium nitrate bomb. Ammonium nitrate ALS fuse.
12 And he's sitting here blaming Hal Hume for his troubles.
13 So there's no sentencing entrapment here. It was
14 something that certainly we were concerned about and we would
15 remedied had we thought it was viable. But this was not a case
16 of Mr. Cox being led down the nose by the government. And you
17 know that too because in the vehicles, you know, when's the
18 most -- the -- if the vehicle when Mr. Cox is arrested -- you
19 know, the time where people think can say what they wish is
20 when they think they're alone and with trusted people. Well,
21 what did he and Mr. Barney talk about? You know, the killing
22 power of the .22. And what does he say about that? You know,
23 Mr. Cox says, you know, it takes longer to die when you die --
24 when you get shot with a .22. Mr. Barney says you got to get
25 in close. I mean, you're familiar with those recordings.
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1 Those are not the recordings of a guy who's saying, "Boy, I'm
2 really concerned utmost about getting my family out of Alaska."
3 Those are recordings and statements of a man who's interested
4 in taking human life.
5 And part of this matrix, Your Honor, is that, you know,
6 if we had just a simple weapons case, one or two counts,
7 certainly we wouldn't be having these discussions. But the
8 bravado that he talks about in taking human life is chilling.
9 And I'm not trying to be -- just stand on my soapbox and be
10 histrionic here. But when he talks about people he doesn't
11 even know, who are just doing their jobs on a daily basis -- a
12 clerk in a courthouse in Fairbanks needs to die and, you know,
13 dangle like a wind chime of liberty -- and then moves on to the
14 next topic -- along with all the other facts that we have in
15 play here, it's dangerous. And that makes him a dangerous man.
16 And his degree of dangerousness is impacted by his ability to
17 lead and the decisions that he made.
18 People make choices in life, Judge, and the choices
19 that he made -- you know, Mr. Cox had a number of times to go
20 down a different road. The people that he valued so much, the
21 senior citizens, the elders, so to speak, of his community,
22 told him to go down a different path and he ignored that. And
23 he reached out to people, and they told him to ignore that. As
24 we said in our memo, he could have told his men on a number of
25 occasions, "Stay home. Take care of your families, stay home."
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30
1 He's telling you in his memo that "I didn't go to court
2 because I was afraid that Mr. Fulton and Mr. Bennett were going
3 to kill me." There isn't a scintilla of evidence in the record
4 to establish that claim. The choice he could have made was
5 gone into court, dealt with it -- because it was a parking
6 ticket, right; they've described it as a traffic ticket --
7 taken your fine, and moved on. But he didn't do that. He
8 safe-harbored in the Vernons' home.
9 It gets -- and the other issue is the degree of
10 specificity that he would go towards, towards collecting
11 information to people to put on his list, whether state or
12 federal, right. For example, Mr. Jones, a trooper, arrested
13 one of Mr. Cox's associates, he made the list. You know, Mr.
14 Cox gets his name and the address, gives it to Olson, "Give
15 that to Anderson." But of course, before you here today,
16 Anderson is to blame too. It was his fault that he listed a
17 U.S. marshal. "I never spoke to him about this. This is all
18 wrong." So how did Mr. Anderson get Trina Beauchamp's name?
19 How did Mr. Anderson get Nanette Curtis's name?
20 You know, claims of alleged, you know, mental illness
21 only can go so far if they're established. But in this case, I
22 mean, this was a man who was empowered by the force of his
23 perceived group behind him, and went out of his way to confront
24 people, again, doing their ordinary job. So who's the next
25 target? You know, somebody that gives him a parking ticket,
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31
1 are they going to make the list?
2 Part of your matrix you have to consider is, again,
3 rehabilitation. But here's a man who has renounced his
4 citizenship to the United States, has developed his own sense
5 of right and wrong based on his view of the world. It'd be
6 nice for everybody to live in their own little world and do
7 what everybody else wanted you to do.
8 But what happens when you buttress and thump up against
9 society in general and a governmental structure, whether it's
10 federal, state, or local? Well, we've got that answer. He
11 threatens them with death. And it's a threat of, you know,
12 "Don't touch me, leave me alone, because I want to do what I
13 want."
14 Even his letters to you, Your Honor, and the letters to
15 the community in general which we supplied in our sentencing
16 memo or it's in the presentence report, there really are no
17 acts of contrition or statements of contrition. It's really
18 about, "I just ran my mouth, and I'm sorry." And that
19 generates the letters from, I'm sure, very well-meaning people,
20 many who I'm sure are here today in support of Mr. Cox. But
21 "embarrassed, scared, didn't know what to do, at my wits' end"
22 don't really cut it. Because you don't hear that in their
23 recordings.
24 What you hear about is forward movement, planning,
25 "When are we going to do this?" And I think there's some
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32
1 reference to -- in the memo about, you know, "I would be okay
2 leaving women and children alone." But who's the one, Judge,
3 as we said in closing, as you sat here in front of Mr. Cox --
4 who's the one who said, "I wouldn't have any trouble killing
5 women and children" during one of these 2-4-1 operations.
6 Nobody else raised that. He did.
7 He even had his lawyer, his former lawyer, Mr. John,
8 write a letter to you. And I want to clear up one thing for
9 the record, because he claims that this OCS information was
10 somehow leaked to the United States. And we take great offense
11 with that. Had Mr. John sat through the court -- through the
12 trial and talked to us or talked to anybody about this, he
13 would have seen that that OCS information used at court came as
14 a result of the search warrants. So I wanted to clear that up
15 for the record.
16 You're going to hear some arguments from Mr. Camiel, I
17 believe, with respect to role in the offense in terms of
18 overstatement of conduct and sentencing disparity and partial
19 acceptance. Mr. Cox is claiming partial acceptance because he
20 admitted to the items found in Mr. Barney's trailer, right.
21 But, Your Honor, that doesn't cut it, and it doesn't make even
22 halfway in terms of a partial acceptance of responsibility.
23 It's one thing to say, "Yeah, two grenade hulls in there were
24 mine." But Mr. Cox's testimony was, "I wasn't going to do
25 anything with them."
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33
1 And, in fact, you know that, given the combination of
2 parts and Mr. Cox's own statements, he had intentions -- and,
3 frankly, probably already did use them to some extent, to an
4 extent unknown. But he certainly indicates knowledge and
5 familiarity with two-second fuses. And, frankly, Mr. Barney's
6 own witness, his cousin, came in and testified that, you know,
7 Mr. Barney and Mr. Cox were practicing with practice grenades.
8 And, further, Mr. Cox's statements of innocence as to
9 the grenades goes -- is rebutted by the testimony of Mr.
10 Brakeman, who said he met Mr. Cox at the meeting at Mr.
11 Fulton's establishment -- or, sorry, at Mr. Bennett's
12 establishment, where Mr. Cox asked him about how to make those
13 grenades active again, thereby getting the instructions on how
14 to do so. So just because Mr. Cox admits to possession of
15 certain items which really don't add much to the equation --
16 the evidence was overwhelming that they were his anyway --
17 doesn't amount to partial acceptance.
18 There is no sentencing entrapment here, as I mentioned,
19 because Mr. Cox had significant predisposition for these items,
20 and, frankly, never said, "I didn't want them." Frankly, Mr.
21 Cox was the one who suggested, "Hey, I'm a little short of cash
22 here. Why don't I trade you my full-automatic with the lowered
23 receiver for the grenades and silencers." So by the time Mr.
24 Cox met with Mr. Olson on March 10th in the morning, he'd
25 already paid for the grenades and the silencers.
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1 The last thing, sentencing disparity. Whereas Mr.
2 Vernon certainly had another objective, as I mentioned, as to
3 Judge Beistline and his family, as did Mrs. Vernon, Mr. Cox had
4 his own agenda. Certainly if the Court is inclined to reduce
5 Mr. Cox's sentence to a lesser degree than what we've suggested
6 and the Pretrial Services officer probation report suggests is
7 in line with our recommendation of 35 years -- Mr. Vernon got
8 25. I'm sure there are -- arguments could be made that Mr.
9 Vernon at some point would have gone off on his own, but he
10 hadn't at that point, and he was still a loyal foot soldier of
11 this man sitting right here.
12 Throughout the course of this case we've established
13 that Mr. Cox attempted to thwart the governmental system and he
14 attempted to collect others to do the same; that he had
15 disregard for the law; and, frankly, by his own statements, he
16 has disregard for man's law in general, that none of these laws
17 apply to him. And you have to take that into account too. He
18 left the state of Alaska, and stayed in the state and made
19 speeches as to strength, wisdom of confronting the governmental
20 structure with the power of a gun. And those statements are
21 dangerous.
22 What else is interesting, Your Honor -- I'm sort of
23 peeling back the layers real specifically here -- is that if
24 you listen to the speeches, he's one of those speakers that --
25 you talk to an audience that's a favorable audience. Okay,
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35
1 people do that all the time. And usually they'd give you
2 positive feedback because you're telling them what you want to
3 hear. But in this case, there is no solution to whatever the
4 governmental problem was, whatever the tyranny problem was,
5 because Mr. Cox would speak away all those solutions. The
6 ballot box didn't work, and that's the point. If you give your
7 audience every reason to say, "My way's the only way" -- a
8 commonsensical rebuttal would be why not the election box, why
9 not voting; he says, "Oh, that doesn't work either." So he
10 wasn't giving those people an out except through the power of
11 violence.
12 So when it boils down here, Judge, you've got somebody
13 before you who is a master manipulator, who moved people
14 forward to accomplish his own means. And those means weren't
15 for effective change. They were advocating for violent change.
16 The collection of the weapons that he had in his possession
17 before he met any government informant, the ideas of killing
18 people who he either didn't know or did know just by virtue of
19 their own position was developed before he met any governmental
20 informant. Because of all these reasons and the facts that
21 we've stated in our sentencing memo, we urge a sentence of 35
22 years.
23 THE COURT: Thank you. Let's take a break, Mr. Camiel,
24 before we hear from you. Okay, we'll take 10 minutes.
25 THE CLERK: All rise. This matter is in recess for 10
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36
1 minutes.
2 (Court recessed at 10:30 a.m., until 10:41 a.m.)
3 THE CLERK: All rise. His Honor the Court, this United
4 States District Court is again in session.
5 THE COURT: Please be seated. Okay, Mr. Camiel. You
6 know, I want to say to you, Mr. Camiel, I appreciate you coming
7 into this case as you did after the trial. I know it's very
8 difficult, and obviously you have done an enormous amount of
9 work on the matter and have raised issues appropriately and
10 done a great deal of good, solid legal work in the written part
11 of this, and the Court appreciates that.
12 MR. CAMIEL: Thank you, Your Honor. Your Honor, the --
13 Mr. Skrocki for the government has -- is obviously very
14 experienced and he can be very persuasive. And he's described
15 Mr. Cox as a master manipulator, and the government has told
16 you that he's not amenable to rehabilitation and you should put
17 him away for 35 years because he is a continuing danger.
18 And I suggest to the Court that there's a lot more to
19 Mr. Cox, more about him and what he was going through, that
20 wasn't appreciated at the time of the trial and before, and
21 over the last several years. And that's not an excuse, but I
22 think it's a fact about what he was going through.
23 When I came into this case, I didn't have the benefit
24 of sitting through the trial. But I read the entire trial
25 transcripts and I read everything I could get my hands on in
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1 terms of the recordings and the discovery. And I started
2 reading with Mr. Cox. He was moved down to Seattle and I was
3 able to meet with him virtually every single week over the last
4 six months, sometimes more than once a week. And as I first
5 started meeting with him, it just struck me, here was the --
6 here was a young guy -- he's still young, he's only 28. And by
7 the time of his early twenties, he was married, he was starting
8 a family. He had a home, he had started a business, and -- you
9 know, it was a remarkable thing. And he seemed -- he'd never
10 been in trouble before as a juvenile, as a teenager, into his
11 early twenties. No criminal history whatsoever.
12 And I'm confronted with this young man who is now
13 convicted of these extremely serious offenses, conspiracy to
14 murder people, and firearm, and destructive device, and it
15 struck me, how did he get from there to where he is right now?
16 And as I listened to him talk and I read the speeches that he
17 gave and I listened to the recordings and I met with him, it
18 struck me that something's not right, that there's a
19 disconnect. He's not seeing how he sounds to other people.
20 He's not seeing how he's reacting to things.
21 And so I approached the Court to be able to have him
22 evaluated. And I chose a very experienced psychologist, Dr.
23 Robin Ladue, who's been at this for nearly 30 years. And she's
24 testified in state and federal courts in Washington and Oregon
25 and other places. And I provided her with a good deal of
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1 materials. And maybe Mr. Skrocki didn't notice; she lists some
2 of them in her report.
3 But I wanted to make sure that she got things that
4 presented the government's side of the case. And that included
5 the government opening and closing -- not the defense side,
6 just the government opening and closing transcripts; the
7 presentence report, the whole draft presentence report that
8 listed in a lot of detail all of the things that Mr. Cox was
9 convicted of doing and what the evidence showed at trial; as
10 well as letters, news articles, and other materials, so that
11 she would get a good dose of what this man had been accused of
12 doing, the kinds of things he was saying, the conduct he was
13 involved in. And she lists a lot of that in her report. And
14 she does that to demonstrate that she was well aware of what he
15 was accused of.
16 And she didn't just meet with him one time or twice.
17 She also had him take well-recognized tests, the MMPI and
18 another test. And those -- she has nothing to do with scoring
19 those, and those are objectively scored by computer. And she
20 came out with her report and her diagnosis based on all of
21 those materials, the meetings, the observations, and she found
22 that Mr. Cox was in fact and has for quite some time been
23 suffering from some pretty serious mental illness, to include
24 paranoid schizophrenia and paranoid delusions, paranoid
25 personality disorder. And she voices opinions about that and
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39
1 the prognosis for that, that I'll get to talking about.
2 But -- and I can appreciate that the government didn't
3 get this report until late. And I'm sorry that that's the way
4 this went forward. But it took a while before I thought that
5 it was something that should be done, and then it took a while
6 to get it done. And I apologize to Probation, that they didn't
7 have the benefit of this report as well, because I think it
8 would have been helpful in them analyzing the report. But Your
9 Honor does have the report. And I believe that it's a valid
10 and well-founded report by an experienced psychologist.
11 And I want to let the Court know that in going about
12 this, Mr. Cox was reluctant to participate in the evaluation at
13 first. And -- but he did participate and he did cooperate in
14 the evaluation. And then when we got the results and I tried
15 to explain it to him, he was reluctant to accept the diagnoses
16 at first. But he talked about it with his wife and his parents
17 and other close family members, and as they thought about it --
18 and I've talked to his father and I've talked to his wife --
19 they began to say, "You know what, that explains a lot of what
20 were going -- was going on, and we wish we would have
21 understood that sooner so we could have done something to
22 intervene and help."
23 And when you take a look at what Mr. Cox -- and he said
24 some terrible things and he was going down a path that could
25 have been extremely harmful and dangerous, and there's no
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40
1 dispute about that. But a lot of this -- he was certainly
2 susceptible to being fed and having this fueled by other events
3 that were going on around him. And we're not using that as
4 some kind of an excuse for his behavior, but there were things
5 that were happening around him that just enhanced his already
6 paranoid view of the world.
7 And, you know, when you take a look at things that he
8 started doing, you had the Child Services attempt to interview
9 his son. That became blown -- because of his paranoia and the
10 way he reacted to that, that became blown out of proportion to
11 such a degree -- and he shows up at Ft. Wainwright with his
12 wife and son, and they're seeking asylum and protection. And
13 he's got this notion in his mind that there is this team of
14 federal assassins out to kill him and his family.
15 And I don't know how anybody can sit there looking back
16 at some of this stuff now and say that this was just an angry
17 guy or a guy who just had very strong anti-government
18 sentiments. There was a very healthy paranoia that was talking
19 over his life, and he acted on that and he continued to act on
20 it, to the point that by March 10th, you've got this guy, he's
21 abandoned his home, he's hiding out with friends, and he's
22 trying to make plans to leave Alaska with his family.
23 And what was pending was this misdemeanor-level firearm
24 charge. I mean, there was certainly no rational reason to have
25 started doing the things that he was doing. And I think Dr.
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1 Ladue's report provides an explanation for what we see was
2 going on with this young man.
3 He was being controlled by this paranoia. And there
4 were things -- you know, when somebody like Officer Gibson from
5 Ft. Wainwright goes to Mr. Cox, somebody who he's never met
6 before, and says, "You know, there were these federal people
7 that showed up at the base, and they say that there may be a
8 shootout with you in order to interview your son," the way that
9 is affecting Mr. Cox, who's already suffering from these
10 delusions and this paranoia, it just starts to grow and become
11 all-consuming.
12 His wife didn't know what to do. She sees him obsessed
13 with this and -- this -- his parents see it, but they're not
14 sure what it is. A lot of -- some of the friends and
15 supporters just kind of wrote it off to, you know, youthful
16 arrogance or being overpassionate or enthusiastic about his
17 views, but it was much, much more serious than that. But it's
18 something that can be dealt with. We know what this is now.
19 And Dr. Ladue has suggested that a regimen of counseling and
20 medication, he would be amenable to.
21 And, you know, the government's telling Your Honor he's
22 not somebody who can be rehabilitated. But I would suggest
23 that the basis for saying that is lacking. Usually when a
24 court is facing a defendant and they came to that conclusion,
25 it's because the defendant has been in front of court after
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1 court after court, offense after offense. They've been
2 sentenced, they've been sent off, they've done their time,
3 they've been put on supervision, they've violated the terms of
4 their supervision, they commit new crimes, and they've
5 demonstrated to the court that they can't be rehabilitated,
6 because they've been given that chance again and again. And
7 you can't say that with Mr. Cox. Up until these recent events,
8 he'd never been in trouble before. He'd never been put in a
9 position where he had to answer to a court or for a probation
10 officer.
11 The other thing that seems very important to me is
12 where Mr. Cox was by March 10th of 2011, the day that he was
13 arrested. And I think that it's indisputable in terms of what
14 was going on that he was trying to leave the state of Alaska
15 with his family. He'd been trying to leave for a while. And
16 yes, he got himself involved with the silencers and the
17 grenades, and I'm not going to argue about that. They were
18 made available to him and he showed an interest that -- in
19 those things.
20 But he was hoping on that day to meet this fictitious
21 trucker who was finally going to secrete he and his family out
22 of the state. And if you think about this, he's trying to
23 leave the state, hiding in a tractor-trailer rig, because he is
24 so paranoid about what's going on in the world around him. And
25 the government says, well, yeah, he was leaving, but he had
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1 talked about coming back at some guerilla war. And we don't
2 know -- I mean, that's speculation as to whether he ever would
3 have come back.
4 And I -- it made me wonder, you know, what -- what if
5 they just let him leave? What if he had left? What if,
6 instead of trying to put grenades and silencers into his hands
7 on March 10th, what if when he first talked about leaving, he
8 had left; would he have continued on this path? And we really
9 don't know. But it was clear he was trying to leave. And the
10 reason I think that's so important is because there's such a
11 stark distinction between what was going on with Mr. Cox and
12 with Mr. Vernon.
13 On March 10th, when Mr. Vernon was arrested, the same
14 ruse with the grenades and the silencers. Mr. Vernon had
15 sitting in his truck not only the maps and the directions to
16 Judge Beistline's house, but the -- he and his wife had already
17 written out these suicide type notes. And yesterday government
18 counsel talked about how they had interrupted Mr. Vernon's
19 plans to commit this horrible act. And there seems little
20 question that that's exactly what they interrupted.
21 What was interrupted with Mr. Cox was his attempt to
22 leave the state. And whether he would have been able to or
23 would have had the will or the intent to carry out the kinds of
24 things that he'd been talking for months about is really, I
25 think, a lot of speculation. Because he certainly had had the
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1 chance for quite a long time to carry out things. And when it
2 gets right down to it, although he talked in ways that are just
3 chilling, he never actually harmed anyone. I mean, for all
4 these weapons that he's collected or was accused of collecting
5 or had been accused of putting together, didn't point at
6 anybody, and it's not clear, even with the paranoia that was
7 going on, that that's the direction he would have ended up
8 going.
9 The other part of this case, and I think it's
10 important, is that, yes, Mr. Cox said things that might have
11 incited other people, and there's no denying that. But I think
12 it's pretty clear that by the time you get to March 10th, he
13 has very little influence over anybody. I mean, Mr. Barney was
14 with him, yes. But Mr. Vernon and Mr. Cox had already had a
15 falling-out and Mr. Vernon was -- had his own demons and his
16 own anger and was going his own direction. Mr. Anderson had
17 seen how paranoid Mr. Cox had become and he moved away from
18 him, as did a lot of the other people, because they saw how far
19 out there he had become in his thinking.
20 So I'm not sure that he by March 10th had the ability
21 to really influence anyone or had the wherewithal. And I'm not
22 sure that had the government not provided him with the
23 silencers and the fake grenades, he had any ability to get
24 these things. This is a guy who had gone around giving
25 speeches about having a 3,500-man militia and lasers and bombs
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1 and missiles, which we all know is pure fantasy. And things --
2 and maybe he believed that. But he didn't have it, and he
3 didn't have the ability to acquire it.
4 I think that one of the other things that's going on is
5 that Mr. Cox completely lacked the ability because of his
6 mental illness to see how other people saw him and how his
7 words sounded to other people. I think he could justify in his
8 own mind what he thought he was saying and thought he was
9 conveying to people, but I'm not sure he appreciate at all how
10 threatening he sounded. I don't think that he understood that
11 when he thought he was approaching somebody in a particular
12 way, they felt threatened. They felt threatened by the words,
13 by his conduct, and I think that it's going to take some time
14 for him to appreciate that kind of thing. I think that's the
15 kind of thing that mental health treatment and medication may
16 assist with.
17 The bottom line for Your Honor is to craft a sentence
18 that's sufficient but not more than necessary in terms of
19 punishment. And that means appreciating not only the
20 seriousness of the offense -- and I would never argue to this
21 Court that these offenses aren't extremely serious -- but also
22 the history and characteristics of the defendant and how much
23 time is necessary to remove him from society, let him get the
24 help he needs, and then get him out on supervision.
25 Now, Mr. Cox has a wife and he's got two very young
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1 children. And he's talked some about that in his letter to the
2 Court. And he has a strong support system of family and
3 friends who now appreciate what was going on. And so I think
4 if and when he is able to get back out in the community, there
5 are people out there that will help him to stay on the right
6 path, because they understand now what was going on with him
7 over the last several years.
8 I simply suggest to the Court that the government's
9 view of Mr. Cox overstates what he was involved in and
10 discounts to much of a degree the mental health aspects of this
11 case that, frankly, weren't known about earlier. And had they
12 been known about, I think it could have made a big difference
13 in Mr. Cox's life and maybe prevented this whole case. Thank
14 you, Your Honor.
15 THE COURT: Thank you, Mr. Camiel. Mr. Cox, anything
16 you want to say about this matter before I determine your
17 sentence, now is the time.
18 THE DEFENDANT: Do I stay seated?
19 THE COURT: You can speak from there. It's fine.
20 THE DEFENDANT: Well, I put myself here with my own
21 words. And I feel horrible about that. And I hurt my family.
22 And that's who's really paying. And I feel horrible about
23 that. And this is devastating to my wife and she is in a
24 position of pain and uncertainty, and I feel -- I know that
25 that is my fault. And my children, who I love with all my
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1 heart, they lost their family as a result of this. The thing
2 that they need the most is their parents and their home there
3 for them while they're growing up, and I -- that was the most
4 important thing in the world to me, and I was so scared that
5 something would jeopardize that that I wound up running right
6 into the very thing I was running away from. I so hurt my
7 family, first and foremost.
8 And I put a lot of people in fear by the things that I
9 said and some of the crazy stuff that was coming out of my
10 mouth. And I see that. And I sounded horrible. I couldn't
11 have sounded any worse if I tried. And the more scared I got,
12 the crazier things I started saying.
13 And I wasn't thinking, I was panicking. And I lost all
14 of my composure and created a horrible mess. And, you know, if
15 I was the FBI, I would investigate me too. I don't blame them
16 for that. And I don't blame anybody but myself for starting
17 this.
18 And -- but for all the crazy things I said, at the end
19 of the day, I knew that -- I knew what I needed to do to take
20 care of myself, and that was get out of -- remove myself from
21 the situation and get away from, you know, aggravating
22 circumstances. And that was what I was trying to do. I was
23 obsessed with that.
24 And, you know, Mr. Skrocki pointed out that I'd talked
25 to Steve Cooper and I talked to all these other people, and
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1 he's right. They saw it. They saw that there was something
2 wrong. And I felt that there was something wrong, and I was
3 terrified of living in a nightmare I couldn't wake up from.
4 That was just -- it still is. I mean, it's gotten even more
5 scary now. Sitting here, about to get sentenced, is even
6 worse.
7 But I felt it and they saw it, and they didn't know
8 what it was. And I didn't know what it was. And -- but it was
9 there. And one thing that I just want to -- really, really
10 want you to know is that I had no intentions of hurting
11 anybody. I had no desire to hurt anybody. I don't think I
12 could have hurt anybody.
13 I didn't have anger that would drive me to lash out. I
14 had fear that drove me to run away. And I know I said a lot of
15 really scary, really intimidating things. And especially when
16 I read those or listen to those now, I -- I'm realizing how
17 serious some of the stuff I said was. But that was not -- that
18 was emotional, fear-driven bluff.
19 And I've never been in a fight in my life. In fact,
20 I've gone two years in jail without a fight, which is unusual.
21 But -- and I'll bluff and run, but I've never been in a fight.
22 And by March 10th, all I wanted was to leave and get, like I
23 said, away -- walk away from the situation and get away from
24 the danger and the agitating factors and regain my composure.
25 Because I knew that I'd lost all composure. And I was doing
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1 some pretty extreme things to try to get away.
2 And I am not a danger to anybody. And I want to really
3 apologize to the people that I scared. And I don't know if
4 it's appropriate, but some of them are here. And, Reverend,
5 I'm really sorry for what I put your family through. And I
6 don't know you as well as I know your boys and Amy and Davy,
7 but I really do love them, and I would -- I was terrified, and
8 I would never do -- and I hope that this can get straightened
9 out and you can know that. And you -- for what it's worth, I
10 love you and I love your family.
11 And Trina and Mark, I know that I made you scared too.
12 And I don't want to keep, you know, going on this, but I never
13 said anything about hurting you or doing anything bad to you to
14 Anderson, and you guys are wonderful people. And I love you
15 and I love Cody and I love Josay (ph) and this -- she's just
16 amazing and wonderful. And, Trina, when you came and testified
17 and you cried, I felt so bad, because I don't want to do
18 anything that would scare you. And I love you and I'm sorry.
19 And, Mark, you're an awesome guy and you've always been a good
20 friend, and I would never hurt you. I just got freaked out and
21 was running my mouth.
22 But there was no nexus -- I don't know where you came
23 up in this, and I'm -- please, just trust me. You know me and
24 you know better. And I'm sorry. Because I could have
25 prevented this whole thing if I'd have had the wherewithal. I
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1 love you and I hope you know that that's true.
2 And that brings me to my children. I have a two-year-
3 old and a four-year-old. And my little girl was born just a
4 couple days before Marti and I decided to move to a different
5 country. And my little boy is my best friend in the world.
6 And I've had some really good friends who have lost children.
7 And I will never, ever understand the pain that a parent goes
8 through when that happens. But I know that it's got to be
9 really devastating for my children to be losing their parents
10 and their home. And there's nothing that I want more than to
11 be there for them during their young, formative years. And
12 there's nothing that I can think of that is worse in this life
13 to lose than that. And I feel like I've lost it, no matter
14 what way this goes. And I would just ask you to have mercy on
15 me and on my family, and sentence me in a way that allows me to
16 be there for my children while they're still children.
17 And I read Dr. Ladue's report, and like -- I told Peter
18 I didn't want to do that at first. I didn't want to talk to
19 her. I dismissed that. I thought, well, maybe, you know -- I
20 don't know, I was skeptical. And then I didn't want to accept
21 the results of what her diagnosis was. But after thinking
22 about it and after talking to my family, to my mother and my
23 father and my wife and some people who know me real well and
24 that I know love me and care about me -- and when they're
25 saying "Yeah, we see that, and that makes sense, and you need
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1 to accept that because that makes sense of things that didn't
2 make sense before," I agree that there's something there. And
3 I want to listen to the people that love me. And I will do
4 whatever I need to to get better, because life has been a
5 horrifying nightmare for the last few years. And that's all I
6 have to say.
7 But I know that I put myself here. And I still am
8 saying that I didn't have any intentions or plans to kill
9 anybody or hurt anybody in any way. But at -- the fact remains
10 that I could have prevented this whole thing from happening and
11 I didn't. And that's my fault.
12 THE COURT: Okay. Thank you, Mr. Cox. Give me 15
13 minutes, I think.
14 THE CLERK: All rise. This matter is in recess for 15
15 minutes.
16 (Court recessed at 11:15 a.m., until 11:32 a.m.)
17 THE CLERK: All rise. His Honor the Court, this United
18 States District Court is again in session.
19 THE COURT: Please be seated. Well, there are a number
20 of things I need to say about this matter. And I hope you'll
21 forgive me for taking a little time to do it, but I think it's
22 appropriate that I address some various issues.
23 The first thing I want to mention are the guidelines.
24 Under the guidelines, that were mandatory sentencing laws up
25 until the last couple of years, if they were still mandatory,
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1 Mr. Cox would be getting life in prison, without question, and
2 I would not have -- under the old law I would not have
3 discretion to do anything other than that. It's interesting to
4 note that the probation officer and the government and the
5 defendant, of course, in their recommendations have all
6 recommended sentences below the guidelines, which is not
7 unusual. And I think the sentencing guidelines have fallen in
8 some disrepute. But, nevertheless, it is something that the
9 Court must determine and consider in sentencing.
10 I want to say something I've said before. And it's
11 important to understand this. This is not a case about free
12 speech. It's not a question of the government trying to shut
13 somebody up. It's a criminal case involving criminal acts, and
14 it's not a case about free speech. It started with some
15 speech-making, I think, but the speech-making, the -- in
16 particular the speech in Montana -- included in it confessions
17 to crimes, possession of illegal weapons and mines and bombs
18 and so forth, and machine guns. It's not surprising that that
19 got the government's attention, and they wanted to investigate
20 that. It's just the same as if somebody made a speech and said
21 they killed somebody else; the government would want to find
22 out if that's true. And so Mr. Cox started the investigation,
23 not because of the nature of his general political philosophy,
24 but because of what he said about criminal acts. And the -- we
25 prize free speech in this country. And that's simply not what
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1 this is about. We welcome those who have differing opinions.
2 The other thing I want to say about this -- I keep
3 reading in the paper about this militia. There was -- it was
4 called a militia, but it never amounted to a militia. There
5 was no militia. It was a group of guys who wanted to form a
6 militia, but they never actually did. A militia, according to
7 Black's Law Dictionary, is a body of citizens armed and trained
8 for military service. This group was never trained for
9 military service. It was a group of people who at one point
10 wanted to form a militia. In my view, it never actually formed
11 and there was never a true militia.
12 Now I want to address the psychological study that was
13 made and the -- a little bit about Mr. Cox's mental status. At
14 the end of the trial, I just made some notes about Mr. Cox
15 after hearing all of the evidence and hearing his testimony.
16 And I wrote down some words that are psychological in nature, I
17 guess, but they're not intended to be, and I'm not qualified to
18 be, diagnostic and -- or to make a diagnosis of these things.
19 But these are what I observed about Mr. Cox at the time of the
20 trial: paranoia; grandiosity; narcissism; egocentricity;
21 pathological lying. Pathological lying, as Mr. Camiel has
22 suggested here, is lying as a result of disease instead of as a
23 result of an intent to lie. And I believe that Mr. Cox lies
24 without knowing that he's lying, often.
25 And the events of the trial and in preparing for this
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1 sentencing, it led me to the conclusion, I guess, that while
2 Mr. Cox is reasonably intelligent or perhaps very intelligent,
3 he is naive. He lacks wisdom. He lacks understanding. He was
4 raised, as the psychologist suggested, in an insular
5 environment. And I think part of the problem that led him into
6 the trouble he's in today is the failure to understand other
7 people, the institutions of government, and perhaps, more than
8 anything, an inability to understand himself.
9 Now, we've heard about the -- this diagnosis. And
10 what's important to know about that, assuming that it's
11 correct, it may supply some reasons for some of what Mr. Cox
12 did, but it does not provide excuses. There was certainly no
13 showing that he should be found not guilty by reason of
14 insanity or anything of the like. But it's part of him, I
15 guess, to some extent, and it's something he has to live with.
16 But it -- and as I say, it may provide a reason for some of
17 what he did, but it is not an excuse. And it's important to
18 note that he has never been so ill as to not be able to have
19 followers and convince people to follow him.
20 I want to talk about the letters that I've received.
21 I've read every one. And there is a theme that goes through
22 the letters that I received on behalf of Mr. Cox. The first
23 theme is that he is a good man, basically, that is -- before
24 this all came up, that he was a good family man, a good worker,
25 a nice person, good neighbor, in all ways. And I have no --
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1 nothing contrary to say about that. I think that is basically
2 true. Although he may have made some mistakes, he basically --
3 before this all came up, before he committed the crimes here,
4 he was a good man with a bright future.
5 The second theme that runs through all these letters,
6 particularly letters from members of Mr. Cox's church and
7 his -- the church his father is pastor of, is that his family
8 needs him. And one of the sad things about sentencing is that
9 there are victims of crimes far beyond the specific victims and
10 people we think of as victims. And criminals are a victim of
11 their own crimes, and their families certainly are victims of
12 those crimes. And how does that play into sentencing?
13 Well, I can tell you what the guidelines law says about
14 family ties and responsibilities: In sentencing a defendant
15 convicted of an offense other than a defense described in the
16 following paragraph -- which is not relevant -- family ties and
17 responsibilities are not ordinarily relevant in determining
18 whether a departure may be warranted. And it goes on to say in
19 the application notes to 5H1.6, the -- there should not be a
20 departure unless the loss or caretaking or financially --
21 financial support substantially exceeds the harm ordinarily
22 incident to incarceration for a similarly situated defendant.
23 And one cannot help but have a great deal of sympathy
24 for Mrs. Cox and their children. But it is just the fix she
25 finds herself in. It's just exactly what happens when the
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1 breadwinner in a family commits crimes. And it's not a
2 justification to escape what is otherwise an appropriate
3 sentence.
4 The third theme that runs through the various letters
5 that I've received on half -- on behalf of Mr. Cox is that he
6 didn't do it, that he's not guilty. And in letter after
7 letter, that idea was expressed. Well, you know, folks, he did
8 do it. He did commit these crimes. The jury made that finding
9 based on the evidence. There's some people that will never
10 accept that. But the law is the law, and the jury is a jury of
11 our peers, and this is the way the system works. They came to
12 court, sat for day after day and heard the testimony. They
13 made the decision, and he is guilty as charged.
14 And I would also say -- well, a subpart of that in
15 these various letters I've read is that the government
16 maliciously made up this whole thing. And those letters are
17 based, I think, in large part on information that came from Mr.
18 Cox. And Mr. Cox said, and the letter he wrote apparently went
19 to -- was in wide circulation -- on August the 4th of this last
20 year, after the trial and conviction, he was still saying that
21 "The government manufactured a case against me. The criminal
22 charges that were brought by man are lies."
23 And, you know, I don't blame people for believing that
24 Mr. Cox was not guilty or that there was some other reason for
25 his conviction. But the information that led to most of those
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1 letters probably came from Mr. Cox. And Mr. Cox is not a
2 reliable person when it comes to telling the truth about these
3 events, or, for that matter, hardly anything else.
4 Now, a subtheme, I guess, of this idea that the
5 government made this all up was that government in some way
6 entrapped Mr. Cox. And entrapment in the law is a particular
7 thing that requires a particular showing, and there was no
8 showing of any entrapment in this case. Certainly Mr. Olson
9 provided the -- and others too, for that matter -- provided the
10 opportunity for Mr. Cox to commit crimes. They did not entrap
11 him into committing crimes. And similarly, there was no
12 sentencing entrapment that has been shown here where the
13 government piles it on just to get a higher sentence. There's
14 just simply no showing of that.
15 When there is a claim, as there was here, that the
16 government has overreached in bringing the charges or in
17 prosecuting a case, the Court watches closely to see if there's
18 some indication of overreaching or unfair prosecution, because
19 that's something that courts are interested in. After all,
20 we're here to stand between the government and the defendant.
21 And I saw no indication of any overreaching by the government
22 at all throughout this case and the presentation of all the
23 evidence. They operated, from what I saw, entirely within the
24 proper and ethical expectations of the public.
25 Now, when we get to sentencing, I think we see rather
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1 typically that the government tends to make things sound
2 perhaps worse than they are, and overstate the case and
3 argument a little bit, and the defendant similarly understates
4 the case and makes it sound perhaps not so bad. But what the
5 Court has to do, I think, is to look at the offenses of
6 conviction and go from that rather than the proper rhetoric of
7 counsel. I don't mean to imply that either side argued
8 inappropriately.
9 There were a number of weapons charges that really are
10 a side issue to the main charges here. The main charges are
11 Count 12, that alleged conspiring to murder officers and
12 employees of the United States. And that requires a showing
13 that there was an agreement between two or more persons to
14 murder officers and employees of the United States, and that
15 the defendant became a member of that conspiracy knowing at
16 least of one of its objects and intending to help accomplish
17 it. And that charge also inquires the showing of an overt act
18 for the purpose of carrying out the conspiracy. The jury found
19 unanimously that Mr. Cox had done that. The evidence, in my
20 view, amply supports that conclusion.
21 In Count 16, it's alleged that Mr. Cox solicitated --
22 solicited the defendants Barney and Vernon and others to engage
23 in the murder of an officer of the United States. And part of
24 the required showing is that the defendant had the intent that
25 another person engage in conduct constituting the murder of an
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1 officer of the United States. The circ -- also that the
2 circumstances must be strongly corroborative of the intent, and
3 that the defendant solicited, commanded, induced, or otherwise
4 endeavored to persuade the other person to commit the murder of
5 an officer of the United States. Again, the evidence supported
6 that charge. The jury found unanimously and beyond a
7 reasonable doubt that that charge was supported by the
8 evidence.
9 So those are the primary convictions that I must use
10 to -- or must base a sentence on. And it doesn't -- you can't
11 really make it worse or not so bad by argument. Those are the
12 basic findings that support a sentence of imprisonment.
13 Now, in determining what is an appropriate sentence, we
14 turn to United States Code, Title 18, Section 3553. And that
15 law says that the Court should impose a sentence sufficient but
16 not greater than necessary to comply with the purposes set
17 forth in the statute. And it directs the Court to consider the
18 nature and circumstances of the offense -- and as I indicated,
19 those convictions speak for themselves -- and also must
20 consider the history and characteristics of the defendant.
21 And in that regard I've already commented on some of
22 the history and characteristics of Mr. Cox. Certainly this was
23 his first serious offense. I think he should be treated as a
24 first offender. And I should recognize that before this came
25 up, he certainly was in all respects a good citizen.
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1 The Court -- the purposes of sentencing that the Court
2 should comment on are found in the statute, and any sentence
3 should reflect the seriousness of the offense and promote
4 respect for the law and provide just punishment. That purpose
5 calls for a long sentence.
6 The second purpose is to afford adequate deterrence to
7 criminal conduct, and the third is to protect the public from
8 further crimes of the defendant. This gives -- raises the
9 question of Mr. Cox's dangerousness. We know from the
10 convictions and the events of the trial that he was a danger to
11 the public in the past. We also know that in spite of his
12 statements, that we can have no confidence that he would not be
13 a danger to the public in the future. And it's obviously very
14 difficult to anticipate, but Mr. Cox's personality and mental
15 status as described indicates to me that the public needs to be
16 protected from him.
17 Third purpose of sentencing is to provide the defendant
18 with needed educational or vocational training, medical care,
19 or other correctional treatment in the most effective manner.
20 If we are to believe the results of the psychological exam, and
21 I tend to think they're pretty accurate, Mr. Cox needs
22 continuing long-term medical care. And I'm not at all
23 satisfied that he would get that outside of a situation of
24 incarceration.
25 The Court also must consider the guidelines, which
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1 militate towards a much longer sentence than I would propose to
2 give Mr. Cox. And it also directs the Court to consider
3 disparities among defendants. And in this situation, the
4 sentence given to Mr. Vernon yesterday is, it seems to me, very
5 similar to what Mr. Cox should receive.
6 Mr. Vernon was a different problem, presented a
7 different -- some different issues than Mr. Cox, and perhaps
8 was much closer to carrying out the murder of a public
9 official. But he was also a follower of Mr. Cox, and I can't
10 help but wonder whether -- how much Mr. Cox's influence over
11 Mr. Vernon may have lent some impetus to Mr. Vernon's desire to
12 kill a federal judge.
13 All things being considered and considering the
14 purposes of sentencing and the issues I've discussed and the
15 conclusions that I've reached, I think that Mr. Cox should be
16 sentenced to 310 months in custody total. That's a long time.
17 that's the same as Mr. Vernon. But we have the most serious
18 offenses here, and it is very, very substantially below the
19 guideline range. So that -- that's a substantial departure or
20 variance from the guidelines.
21 Now, I don't know if -- I guess I need to recite here
22 the -- how that shakes out with the other offenses. But Mr.
23 Cox should be committed to the custody of the Bureau of Prisons
24 for a term of 310 months, with credit for time served since his
25 arrest. And that will consist of 60 months on Count 1, 120
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1 months on Count 2, 120 months on Count 3, 120 months on Count
2 4, 120 months on Count 5, 120 months on Count 6, 120 months on
3 Count 10, and 310 months on Count 12, and I believe 240 on
4 Count 16, all of those counts and prison terms to be served
5 concurrently.
6 Upon release from custody, he should be subject to
7 supervised release for five years and -- on each count, and
8 those counts -- the supervised release should also be served
9 concurrently. There's no basis to justify a fine in this case.
10 I'll affix no fine, but the law does require a special
11 assessment of $900. And that's the judgment of the Court.
12 Now, Mr. Cox, it's appropriate for me to advise you at
13 this point of your right to appeal your conviction and
14 sentence. You do have a right to appeal. If you don't file a
15 notice of appeal within 14 days of the day that I actually sign
16 the judgment, you will irrevocably lose that right to appeal.
17 And if you request it, the Clerk of Court would sign a notice
18 of -- or would file a notice of appeal on your behalf. You
19 should also note that if you wish to appeal and you have no
20 funds to employ a lawyer for that purpose, and if you request
21 it under those circumstances, the Court would appoint a lawyer
22 to represent you on appeal at public expense. Do you
23 understand those things?
24 THE DEFENDANT: Yes, Your Honor.
25 THE COURT: And Mr. Camiel I'm sure can further advise
A & T TRANSCRIPTS
63
1 you about that and assist you if you wish to file a notice of
2 appeal or request counsel.
3 Okay, I'll sign the judgment as soon as it's prepared
4 by the clerk.
5 THE CLERK: Judge, were all the forfeiture -- take --
6 that was all taken care of?
7 THE COURT: I think I've already taken care of the
8 forfeit --
9 MR. SKROCKI: We believe so.
10 THE CLERK: All right. Thank you. All rise. This
11 matter is now adjourned. This court is adjourned, subject to
12 call.
13 (Proceedings concluded at 12:01 p.m.)
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
A & T TRANSCRIPTS
64
1 CERTIFICATE
2 I certify that the foregoing is a correct transcript from the

electronic sound recording of the proceedings in the above-
3 entitled matter.
4
s/Teresa K. Combs 3/20/13
5 Teresa K. Combs, Transcriber Date
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
A & T TRANSCRIPTS
65
U.S. v. Cox, 3:11-cr-00022-01-RJB
1/8/13 - index
.22. ... 28 4,000 ... 21 affect ... 5, 15 applied ... 7, 11 B

affected ... 13 applies ... 10-12, 18 back ... 8, 9, 12, 21, 24, 34,
$900 ... 62 40 ... 23
affecting ... 41 apply ... 9-12, 16, 27, 34 40, 43, 46
1 ... 6, 18, 24, 32, 61 45 ... 19
affix ... 62 applying ... 15 background ... 20, 21
10 ... 6, 18, 26, 35, 36, 62 4th ... 56
afford ... 60 appoint ... 62 ball ... 4
10:30 ... 36 5 ... 8, 11, 24, 62
afraid ... 30 appreciate ... 36, 39, 45, 46 ballot ... 35
10:41 ... 36 5H1.6 ... 55
against ... 11, 26, 31, 56 appreciated ... 36 bank ... 10
10th ... 33, 40, 42-44, 48 6 ... 6, 18, 55, 62
agenda ... 34 appreciates ... 36 Barney ... 7, 11, 14, 17, 27,
11 ... 3, 51 60 ... 61
agents ... 11 appreciating ... 45 28, 33, 44, 58
11:15 ... 51 8 ... 3
aggravating ... 18, 47 apprehension ... 11 bartering ... 14
11:32 ... 51 9:27 ... 3
aggrieved ... 26 approached ... 37 base ... 7-9, 18, 41, 59
1114 ... 8 924 ... 6
approaching ... 45 based ... 8, 12, 16, 19, 20,
1117 ... 8 A agitating ... 48
agree ... 19, 51 appropriate ... 5, 6, 9, 10, 16, 22, 31, 38, 56
12 ... 6-8, 11, 12, 18, 25, 27, a.m. ... 3, 36, 51
agreement ... 19, 58 49, 51, 56, 59, 62 basic ... 59
58, 62, 63 Aaron ... 24, 26
ahead ... 25, 26 appropriately ... 36 basis ... 5, 26, 29, 41, 62
12:01 ... 63 abandoned ... 40
Alaska ... 3, 24, 29, 34, 40, Arguably ... 19 became ... 40, 58
120 ... 61, 62 abilities ... 17
42 argue ... 13, 42, 45 become ... 41, 44
13 ... 64 ability ... 29, 44, 45
alleged ... 30, 58 argued ... 8, 13, 16, 58 began ... 39
135 ... 6 able ... 37, 43, 46, 54
allows ... 50 argues ... 12 behavior ... 40
14 ... 62 above ... 64
alone ... 28, 31, 32 argument ... 7, 25, 58, 59 behind ... 26, 30
142 ... 7 accept ... 39, 50, 51, 56
ALS ... 28 arguments ... 32, 34 Beistline ... 27, 34
143 ... 17 acceptance ... 32, 33
amalgamation ... 20, 21 armed ... 53 believed ... 12, 45
144 ... 10 accepting ... 25
amazing ... 49 armor ... 10-12, 18, 19, 26 believing ... 56
15 ... 51 accomplish ... 35, 58
amenable ... 36, 41 arrest ... 61 below ... 52, 61
16 ... 6, 7, 11, 12, 18, 58, 62 according ... 53
Amendment ... 23, 26 arrested ... 28, 30, 42, 43 benefit ... 36, 39
18 ... 8, 18, 59 account ... 8, 25, 34
Ammonium ... 28 arrogance ... 41 Bennett ... 24, 26, 30
2 ... 10, 18, 19, 32, 62 accurate ... 26, 60
ammunition ... 27 articles ... 38 big ... 8, 15, 46
20 ... 26, 64 accused ... 38, 44
among ... 61 aspects ... 46 Bill ... 24, 26
2010 ... 27 acquire ... 45
amount ... 33, 36 assassins ... 40 bit ... 22, 53, 58
2011 ... 42 act ... 40, 43, 58
amounted ... 53 assessment ... 62 blame ... 15, 22, 23, 30, 47,
2013 ... 3 acted ... 23, 40
amply ... 58 assist ... 45, 63 56
22 ... 3, 28 actions ... 21, 22, 24
Amy ... 49 associates ... 30 blamed ... 15
240 ... 62 active ... 33
analysis ... 10 asylum ... 40 blames ... 27
25 ... 27, 34 acts ... 31, 52
analyzing ... 39 ATF ... 15 blaming ... 21, 22, 24, 28
28 ... 37 actual ... 4, 13
ANCHORAGE ... 3 attempt ... 11, 40, 43 block ... 21
2A1.5 ... 8 add ... 18, 19, 33
Anderson ... 18, 24, 30, 44, attempted ... 26, 34 blown ... 40
2K2.1 ... 6 added ... 4
49 attention ... 4, 6, 20, 52 bluff ... 48
3 ... 44, 62, 64 adding ... 8, 18
anger ... 17, 44, 48 attorney ... 3 body ... 10-12, 18, 19, 26, 53
3,500 ... 44 addition ... 10
angry ... 40 audacious ... 22 boils ... 35
30 ... 36, 37 address ... 6, 13, 30, 51, 53
anti ... 40 audacity ... 22 bomb ... 28
310 ... 61, 62 addressed ... 5, 9
anticipate ... 4, 60 audience ... 34, 35 bombs ... 44, 52
33 ... 8, 9, 18, 19 adequate ... 60
anyway ... 33 August ... 56 born ... 50
34 ... 18 adequately ... 5
apologize ... 39, 49 authorities ... 9 both ... 12
35 ... 23, 34-36 adjourned ... 63
apparently ... 56 automatic ... 14, 15, 33 bottom ... 5, 45
3553 ... 20, 59 adjustment ... 11, 13
appeal ... 62, 63 available ... 42 box ... 13, 14, 35
39 ... 8 admits ... 33
appears ... 19 avoid ... 11 Boy ... 29, 50
3A1.2 ... 10 admitted ... 32
application ... 4, 5, 7, 9, 11, avoids ... 15 boys ... 49
3B1.1 ... 18 advice ... 15
18, 55 aware ... 38 Brakeman ... 33
3B1.5 ... 11 advise ... 62
applications ... 16 awesome ... 49 bravado ... 29
4 ... 18, 21, 24, 32, 62 advocating ... 35
A & T TRANSCRIPTS
66
U.S. v. Cox, 3:11-cr-00022-01-RJB
1/8/13 - index
43, 47 contemplate ... 10 Cox ... 3, 8, 11-14, 17, 20,

breadwinner ... 56 changing ... 6
commanded ... 59 content ... 4, 5 22-39, 41-46, 51-62
break ... 35 characteristics ... 45, 59
comment ... 60 contents ... 5 craft ... 45
briefs ... 5 charge ... 13, 40, 58, 59
commented ... 59 context ... 24 crazier ... 47
bright ... 55 charged ... 6-10, 19, 56
comments ... 6 continual ... 21 crazy ... 47
brings ... 50 charges ... 12, 13, 56-58
commission ... 11, 16 continually ... 14, 15 created ... 47
Brockman ... 17 Child ... 40
commit ... 8-10, 42, 43, 56, continued ... 40, 43 creation ... 14
brought ... 56 children ... 32, 46, 50, 55
57, 59 continuing ... 36, 60 credit ... 61
Bryan ... 3 chilling ... 29, 44
commits ... 56 contradicted ... 14, 22 cried ... 49
building ... 21 chime ... 29
committed ... 12, 13, 55, 61 contrary ... 55 crime ... 6, 8, 10, 11, 16
built ... 23 choice ... 30
committing ... 57 contrition ... 31 crimes ... 42, 52, 55-57, 60
Bureau ... 61 choices ... 29
commonsensical ... 35 control ... 17 criminal ... 17, 19, 37, 52,
business ... 37 chose ... 37
community ... 20, 29, 31, 46 controlled ... 41 56, 60
buttress ... 31 church ... 55
completely ... 45 convention ... 14, 27 criminals ... 55
C circ ... 59
comply ... 59 conversation ... 22 critical ... 24, 28
calculation ... 19 Circuit ... 9
composure ... 47, 48 conversations ... 14 crosses ... 26
calculations ... 19 circulation ... 56
computation ... 6 convert ... 15 custody ... 61, 62
call ... 3, 63 circumstance ... 25
computer ... 28, 38 conveying ... 45 cut ... 31, 32
called ... 23, 53 circumstances ... 7, 47, 59,
calls ... 60 62 concern ... 27 convicted ... 37, 38, 55 D
concerned ... 28, 29 conviction ... 3, 9, 10, 12, daily ... 29
CAMIEL ... 3, 4, 6, 7, 10, cited ... 9
concerted ... 21 56, 58, 62 danger ... 36, 48, 49, 60
12, 13, 16, 19, 20, 32, cites ... 13
concluded ... 63 convictions ... 25, 59, 60 dangerous ... 29, 34, 39
35, 36, 46, 53, 62 citizen ... 59
conclusion ... 41, 54, 58 convicts ... 12 dangerousness ... 29, 60
can ... 4, 12, 15, 16, 18, 21, citizens ... 20, 29, 53
conclusions ... 61 convince ... 54 dangle ... 29
25, 28, 30, 36, 39-41, citizenship ... 31
concrete ... 11, 14 convincing ... 16 Date ... 64
46, 49, 50, 55, 60, 62 claim ... 30, 57
concurrently ... 62 Cooper ... 23, 47 dates ... 7
capable ... 22 claiming ... 14, 21, 32
conduct ... 17, 32, 38, 45, cooperate ... 39 Davy ... 49
car ... 27 claims ... 30, 32
58, 60 correctional ... 60 day ... 26, 42, 47, 56, 62
care ... 24, 29, 47, 50, 60, 63 clarify ... 7, 10
confessions ... 52 correctly ... 13 days ... 13, 50, 62
caretaking ... 55 Clark ... 22
confidence ... 60 corroborative ... 59 deal ... 12, 36, 37, 55
carry ... 9, 26, 43, 44 clerk ... 3, 29, 35, 36, 51,
conflict ... 15 counsel ... 5, 23, 43, 58, 63 dealing ... 10
carrying ... 6, 58, 61 62, 63
confront ... 30 counseling ... 41 dealt ... 5, 30, 41
case ... 4-13, 20, 21, 24-30, close ... 13, 28, 39
confronted ... 37 Count ... 8, 11, 12, 16, 58, death ... 31
34-36, 38, 44, 46, 52, closely ... 57
confronting ... 34 61, 62 decided ... 12, 50
56-58, 62 closer ... 61
conjunction ... 21 counting ... 8, 9 decision ... 56
cases ... 9, 12 closing ... 15, 32, 38
connection ... 6, 7, 18 country ... 50, 52 decisions ... 24, 29
cash ... 33 Code ... 8, 59
consider ... 20, 31, 52, 59-61 counts ... 3, 6, 7, 11, 18, 29, defendant ... 3, 11, 12, 16,
categories ... 4 Cody ... 49
considered ... 16, 61 62 18, 41, 45, 46, 52, 55,
category ... 19 collateral ... 13
considering ... 27, 61 couple ... 5, 15, 21, 50, 51 57-60, 62
cause ... 3 collect ... 34
consist ... 61 course ... 5, 18, 26, 30, 34, defendants ... 15, 21, 58, 61
CDs ... 28 collected ... 44
consistent ... 16 52 defense ... 6, 38, 55
certain ... 21, 33 collecting ... 30, 44
consistently ... 16 Court ... 3-7, 9-11, 13, defined ... 11
certainly ... 5-7, 11, 12, 17, collection ... 35
conspiracy ... 7-11, 18, 37, 15-20, 26, 30, 32, degree ... 13, 17, 21, 22, 29,
18, 20, 26-29, 33, 34, combination ... 33
58 34-37, 39, 41, 42, 45, 30, 34, 40, 46
40, 43, 54, 55, 57, 59 Combs ... 64
conspiring ... 58 46, 51, 52, 56-63 deliberation ... 25
CERTIFICATE ... 64 come ... 12, 15, 21, 24, 25,
constituting ... 58 courthouse ... 29 delusional ... 21
certify ... 64 43
consuming ... 41 courtroom ... 21, 23 delusions ... 38, 41
chance ... 42, 44 comes ... 3, 10, 12, 14, 18,
contact ... 11 courts ... 37, 57 demons ... 17, 44
change ... 5, 7, 25, 35 23, 57
contacted ... 20 cousin ... 33 demonstrate ... 38
changed ... 4, 5 coming ... 23, 24, 26, 36,
A & T TRANSCRIPTS
67
U.S. v. Cox, 3:11-cr-00022-01-RJB
1/8/13 - index
escape ... 56 fan ... 11 forfeit ... 63

demonstrated ... 42 double ... 8, 9
essentially ... 14, 21 fantasy ... 45 forfeiture ... 63
denial ... 21 doubt ... 16, 24, 59
establish ... 11, 23, 30 far ... 30, 44, 55 forgive ... 51
deny ... 21 doubts ... 16, 18
established ... 7, 24, 27, 30, father ... 39, 50, 55 form ... 17, 53
denying ... 44 Dr ... 37, 40, 41, 50
34 fault ... 23, 30, 46, 51 formative ... 50
departure ... 27, 55, 61 draft ... 38
establishment ... 33 favor ... 16, 18 formed ... 53
depth ... 26 drawn ... 27
estimation ... 13 favorable ... 34 former ... 32
described ... 14, 30, 36, 55, drive ... 48
ethical ... 57 FBI ... 14, 24, 47 forth ... 52, 59
60 driven ... 48
evaluated ... 37 fear ... 47, 48 forward ... 31, 35, 39
destructive ... 18, 37 drives ... 8
evaluation ... 39 February ... 14, 27 found ... 15, 17, 18, 27, 28,
determine ... 3, 4, 46, 52 drove ... 48
events ... 5, 12, 19, 40, 42, fed ... 40 32, 38, 54, 58-60
determining ... 16, 55, 59 DVDs ... 15
federal ... 8-11, 18, 19, 30, founded ... 39
deterrence ... 20, 60 E 53, 57, 60
everybody ... 22, 23, 31 31, 37, 40, 41, 61 four ... 6, 12, 17-19, 50
devastating ... 46, 50 each ... 62
everything ... 5, 25, 27, 36 feedback ... 35 Francis ... 3
developed ... 31, 35 earlier ... 46
evidence ... 11, 12, 15, 16, feel ... 46, 50 frankly ... 9, 14, 22, 25, 26,
device ... 18, 37 early ... 37
22, 23, 27, 30, 33, 38, feet ... 25 33, 34, 46
diagnoses ... 39 educational ... 60
53, 56-59 felony ... 6, 7, 18 freaked ... 49
diagnosis ... 38, 50, 53, 54 effective ... 35, 60
exam ... 60 felt ... 5, 45, 48, 49 free ... 52
diagnostic ... 53 egocentricity ... 53
example ... 14, 15, 24-26, 30 fictitious ... 42 freedom ... 15
Dictionary ... 53 elders ... 29
examples ... 14, 15 fight ... 48 friend ... 49, 50
die ... 28, 29 election ... 35
exceeds ... 55 figure ... 10 friends ... 24, 40, 41, 46, 50
difference ... 26, 27, 46 electronic ... 64
except ... 21, 35 figuring ... 9 front ... 13, 32, 41
different ... 9, 27, 29, 50, 61 elements ... 9, 10
excuses ... 24, 25, 54 file ... 62, 63 Ft ... 40, 41
differing ... 53 email ... 24, 27
expectations ... 57 filed ... 4, 5, 13, 20 fueled ... 40
difficult ... 13, 36, 60 emails ... 24
expecting ... 11 financial ... 55 full ... 33
direction ... 44 embarrassed ... 31
expense ... 62 financially ... 55 fully ... 11, 14, 15
directions ... 43 emotional ... 48
experienced ... 36, 37, 39 find ... 9, 18, 52 Fulton ... 24, 26, 30
directly ... 9 employ ... 62
explain ... 39 finding ... 16, 19, 27, 56 fun ... 14
directs ... 59, 61 employees ... 7, 58
explains ... 39 findings ... 9, 19, 59 funds ... 62
disconnect ... 37 empowered ... 30
explanation ... 41 finds ... 55 further ... 11, 14, 15, 17, 33,
discounted ... 25 encompass ... 10
expressed ... 56 fine ... 6, 30, 46, 62 60, 62
discounts ... 46 endeavored ... 59
extreme ... 49 firearm ... 6, 37, 40 furtherance ... 6, 7
discovery ... 37 enforcement ... 11, 26
F firearms ... 6, 7 fuse ... 28
discretion ... 52 engage ... 58
facade ... 26 first ... 3, 4, 6, 18-20, 26, 37, fuses ... 28, 33
discussions ... 29 enhance ... 11
facilitate ... 11 39, 43, 47, 50, 51, 54, future ... 55, 60
disease ... 53 enhanced ... 40
dismissed ... 50 enhancement ... 6-10, 16, facing ... 41 59 G
factors ... 20, 25, 48 five ... 17, 18, 27, 62 game ... 23
disorder ... 21, 38 18, 19
failure ... 54 fix ... 9, 55 garden ... 14
disparities ... 61 enormous ... 36
fair ... 13 flippant ... 23 gave ... 37
disparity ... 32, 34 enthusiastic ... 41
Fairbanks ... 29 fly ... 28 general ... 5, 31, 34, 52
disposition ... 20 entire ... 36
fake ... 44 folks ... 56 generates ... 31
dispute ... 7, 40 entirely ... 9, 57
fallacy ... 26 follow ... 54 gentleman ... 22
disregard ... 34 entitled ... 64
fallen ... 52 follower ... 61 gentlemen ... 22, 23
disrepute ... 52 entrance ... 18
falling ... 44 followers ... 54 get ... 13, 14, 16, 20, 27, 28,
distinction ... 11, 43 entrap ... 57
familiarity ... 33 following ... 55 30, 36-39, 44-49, 51,
District ... 3, 36, 51 entrapment ... 27, 28, 33,
families ... 29, 55 foot ... 27, 34 57, 60
disturbing ... 25 57
family ... 24, 27, 29, 34, 37, force ... 11, 30 gets ... 8, 30, 44
division ... 6 entrapped ... 57
39, 40, 42, 46, 47, 49, foregoing ... 64 Gibson ... 41
documents ... 3 environment ... 54
50, 54-56 foremost ... 47 girl ... 50
dose ... 38 equation ... 17, 33
A & T TRANSCRIPTS
68
U.S. v. Cox, 3:11-cr-00022-01-RJB
1/8/13 - index
improper ... 9 JANUARY ... 3 43, 48

Give ... 5, 18, 30, 35, 51, 61 healthy ... 40
inability ... 54 jeopardize ... 47 leaving ... 32, 42, 43
given ... 21, 33, 42, 61 hear ... 23, 24, 26, 31, 32,
inaccurate ... 13 job ... 27, 30 led ... 17, 22, 28, 54, 56
gives ... 30, 60 35
inappropriately ... 58 jobs ... 29 left ... 5, 15, 34, 43
go ... 4, 6, 8, 14, 15, 18, 20, heard ... 4, 25, 54, 56
incarceration ... 55, 60 John ... 32 legal ... 27, 36
22, 23, 27, 29, 30, 58 hearing ... 53
incited ... 44 Jones ... 30 leniency ... 22
going ... 12, 13, 22-25, heart ... 47
inclined ... 34 Josay ... 49 lent ... 61
30-32, 36, 39-46, 49 held ... 14
inconsistent ... 12 judge ... 20, 22, 25-27, 29, lesser ... 34
gone ... 30, 34, 44, 48 help ... 39, 45, 46, 55, 58,
incorporates ... 8, 9 32, 34, 35, 43, 61, 63 letter ... 22, 32, 46, 56
good ... 3, 36-38, 49, 50, 54, 61
increase ... 10, 12, 18 judges ... 12, 26 letters ... 5, 21, 23, 31, 38,
55, 59 helpful ... 39
increases ... 10 judgment ... 62, 63 54-57
govern ... 8 hey ... 24, 33
indicated ... 10, 12, 17, 59 jurisdiction ... 8 level ... 6, 8-10, 14, 16, 18,
government ... 3, 4, 7-9, 12, hiding ... 40, 42
indication ... 57 jurors ... 17 19, 40
13, 17, 20, 24, 27, 28, higher ... 19, 57
indisputable ... 42 jury ... 9, 12-15, 17, 18, 56, levels ... 8, 10, 12
35, 36, 38-40, 42-44, history ... 19, 37, 45, 59
induced ... 59 58, 59 liberty ... 29
52, 54, 56-58 histrionic ... 29
influence ... 44, 61 justice ... 12, 15 lied ... 16
governmental ... 31, 34, 35 hit ... 23
informant ... 24, 35 justification ... 56 lies ... 53, 56
grandiosity ... 53 hold ... 9
informed ... 14 justify ... 45, 62 line ... 5, 24, 26, 34, 45
greater ... 59 home ... 15, 26, 28-30, 37,
innocence ... 33 juvenile ... 37 list ... 13, 30, 31
grenade ... 32 40, 47, 50
grenades ... 14, 24, 27, 28, Honor ... 3, 4, 6, 7, 9-17, inquires ... 58 K listed ... 20, 30, 38
insanity ... 54 kernels ... 23 listened ... 20, 22, 24, 37
33, 42-44 19-25, 27, 29, 31, 32,
insertion ... 14 kill ... 24, 30, 40, 51, 61 listening ... 23
group ... 6, 18, 22, 23, 30, 53 34, 36, 39, 41, 45, 46,
institutions ... 54 killed ... 52 lists ... 38
grouping ... 6, 19 51, 62
instructions ... 9, 15, 33 killing ... 24, 28, 32, 35 local ... 31
grow ... 41 Honorable ... 3
insular ... 54 kinds ... 38, 43 long ... 10, 13, 21-23, 25, 27,
growing ... 47 hope ... 49-51
intelligent ... 22, 54 KJNP ... 17, 18, 24 44, 60, 61
guerilla ... 24, 43 hoping ... 42
intended ... 7-9, 53 knock ... 23 longer ... 10, 21, 23, 28, 61
guess ... 4, 6, 53, 54, 57, 61 horrible ... 43, 46, 47
intending ... 58 knowing ... 11, 53, 58 Lonnie ... 26, 27
guideline ... 4, 6, 8, 10, 11, horrifying ... 51
intent ... 43, 53, 58, 59 knowledge ... 14, 33 look ... 5, 8, 17, 21, 22, 24,
15, 16, 18, 19, 61 hose ... 14
intentions ... 33, 48, 51 known ... 26, 46 39, 40, 58
guidelines ... 4-6, 8-11, 16, house ... 43
18, 19, 51, 52, 55, 60, hulls ... 32 interest ... 42 L looked ... 14, 25
interesting ... 34, 52 lacked ... 45 looking ... 5, 6, 28, 40
61 human ... 29
interrupted ... 43 lacking ... 41 lose ... 50, 62
guilty ... 54, 56 Hume ... 22, 28
intervene ... 39 lacks ... 54 losing ... 50
gun ... 14, 15, 34 hurt ... 46-49, 51
interview ... 40, 41 Ladue ... 37, 41 loss ... 55
guns ... 18, 23, 52 hurting ... 48, 49
Lamoureux ... 3, 20 lost ... 47, 48, 50
guys ... 24, 49, 53 I intimidating ... 48
intricate ... 14 land ... 8 lot ... 4, 16, 17, 21-25, 36,
H ideas ... 35
investigate ... 47, 52 large ... 5, 10, 13, 56 38-41, 43, 44, 47, 48
Hal ... 22, 28 ignored ... 23, 29
investigation ... 14, 16, 26, lasers ... 44 love ... 46, 49-51
half ... 56 II ... 14
52 lash ... 48 lowered ... 33
halfway ... 32 ill ... 54
investigative ... 14, 21 late ... 39 loyal ... 34
hand ... 14, 27 illegal ... 52
irrevocably ... 62 lawyer ... 32, 62 lying ... 53
hands ... 36, 43 illness ... 30, 38, 45
happening ... 40, 51 impacted ... 29 issue ... 7, 16, 23, 30, 58 layers ... 34 M
issues ... 4, 6, 13, 16, 20, 36, lead ... 29 machine ... 14, 15, 52
harbored ... 30 impetus ... 61
51, 61 leader ... 17, 22, 23 machining ... 14
harder ... 10 imply ... 58
items ... 7, 32, 33 leadership ... 17, 23 main ... 58
harm ... 55 important ... 20, 22, 27,
J leads ... 19 make ... 7, 10, 11, 19, 24,
harmed ... 44 42-44, 47, 52, 54
J.R. ... 23, 24, 26, 28 leaked ... 32 27-29, 31-33, 38, 40,
harmful ... 39 impose ... 13, 59
jail ... 48 leave ... 22, 24, 31, 40, 42, 51, 53, 58, 59
health ... 13, 45, 46 imprisonment ... 59
A & T TRANSCRIPTS
69
U.S. v. Cox, 3:11-cr-00022-01-RJB
1/8/13 - index
objects ... 58 overreaching ... 57 perspective ... 25

making ... 16, 52 misdemeanor ... 40
obligation ... 15 overstate ... 58 persuade ... 59
maliciously ... 56 missiles ... 45
observations ... 38 overstatement ... 32 persuasive ... 17, 36
man ... 22, 29-31, 34, 37, 38, mistake ... 15
observed ... 53 overstates ... 19, 46 Peter ... 50
41, 44, 54-56 mistakes ... 55
obsessed ... 41, 47 overt ... 58 ph ... 49
management ... 17, 27 mix ... 18
obstructed ... 12 overwhelming ... 15, 33 philosophy ... 52
mandatory ... 51 MMPI ... 38
obstructing ... 13 own ... 14, 17, 28, 31, 33-35, physical ... 11
manipulator ... 25, 35, 36 Mole ... 23
obstruction ... 12, 13, 15, 16, 44-46, 55 picture ... 15
manufacture ... 14 Montana ... 52
manufactured ... 14, 56 months ... 37, 43, 61, 62 18, 19 P piece ... 28
obtain ... 27 p.m. ... 63 pieces ... 15
many ... 6, 16, 17, 31 morning ... 3, 33
occasions ... 29 paid ... 33 piles ... 57
maps ... 27, 43 mother ... 50
occurred ... 18, 19 pain ... 46, 50 pitch ... 14
March ... 33, 40, 42-44, 48 mouth ... 31, 47, 49
OCS ... 32 panicking ... 47 place ... 8
Mark ... 49 move ... 50
offender ... 59 paperwork ... 6 places ... 37
married ... 37 moved ... 30, 35, 37, 44
offense ... 6-11, 18, 19, 32, paranoia ... 40, 41, 44, 53 planning ... 31
marshal ... 30 movement ... 31
42, 45, 55, 59, 60 paranoid ... 21, 38, 40, 42, plans ... 40, 43, 51
Marti ... 50 moves ... 29
offenses ... 10, 12, 18, 19, 44 play ... 29, 55
master ... 25, 35, 36 much ... 10, 17, 21, 29, 33,
37, 45, 58, 61 parent ... 50 pointed ... 47
material ... 13 41, 45, 46, 61
office ... 20, 24, 25 parents ... 39, 41, 47, 50 points ... 19, 27
materials ... 38 murder ... 8, 9, 18, 27, 37,
officer ... 3, 6, 7, 11, 17, 34, parking ... 30 political ... 52
matrix ... 21, 29, 31 58, 59, 61
partial ... 32, 33 pops ... 23
matters ... 5 N 41, 42, 52, 58, 59
officers ... 58 participants ... 17, 18 portrays ... 22
means ... 35, 45 naive ... 54
official ... 7-9, 61 participate ... 39 posed ... 20
measure ... 13 Nanette ... 30
officials ... 10, 18 particularly ... 10, 55 position ... 16, 21, 35, 42, 46
medical ... 60 narcissism ... 53
often ... 53 parts ... 33 positive ... 35
medication ... 41, 45 necessary ... 5, 20, 45, 59
old ... 50, 52 past ... 60 possessed ... 6, 7
meet ... 37, 38, 42 needed ... 47, 60
older ... 22 pastor ... 55 possession ... 6, 7, 14, 33,
meeting ... 24, 33, 37 neighbor ... 54
Olson ... 14, 23, 24, 26-28, path ... 22, 23, 29, 39, 43, 46 35, 52
meetings ... 38 net ... 18
30, 33, 57 pathological ... 53 powder ... 28
member ... 58 nevertheless ... 10, 11, 52
omitted ... 4 Pause ... 11, 17 power ... 26, 28, 34, 35
members ... 11, 27, 39, 55 new ... 42
one ... 4, 6-10, 12, 14, 15, paying ... 46 practice ... 33
memo ... 9, 18, 20, 29-32, 35 news ... 38
17, 19, 21, 22, 24-26, peeling ... 34 practicing ... 33
memorandum ... 6, 17 nexus ... 49
29, 30, 32-34, 38, 45, peers ... 56 predicament ... 22
memos ... 21 nice ... 31, 54
48, 53-55, 58 pending ... 40 predisposed ... 27
men ... 29 nightmare ... 48, 51
ones ... 5 penitent ... 21 predisposition ... 33
mental ... 13, 30, 38, 45, 46, Ninth ... 9
ongoing ... 10 people ... 4, 17, 22-24, 26, preparation ... 11
53, 60 nitrate ... 28
open ... 5, 13, 20 28-31, 35, 37, 41, prepared ... 5, 63
mercy ... 50 Nobody ... 20, 32
opening ... 20, 38 44-47, 49-51, 53-56 preparing ... 53
merit ... 5 nose ... 28
operable ... 28 perceived ... 12, 13, 30 present ... 3
mess ... 47 note ... 52, 54, 62
operated ... 57 perhaps ... 54, 58, 61 presentation ... 57
met ... 23-25, 33, 35, 37, 41 notes ... 5, 43, 53, 55
operations ... 32 period ... 10 presented ... 12, 38, 61
metal ... 14 notice ... 38, 62, 63
opinions ... 38, 53 perjuring ... 13 presentence ... 3-7, 12, 17,
Michael ... 18 notion ... 40
opposed ... 10 perjurious ... 12, 14 19, 31, 38
Mike ... 24 numbers ... 18, 19
perjury ... 12, 13, 15, 16 presiding ... 3
military ... 53 O Order ... 3, 6, 41
ordinarily ... 55 permission ... 20 Pretrial ... 34
militate ... 61 object ... 20
Oregon ... 37 person ... 3, 11, 12, 20, 22, prevented ... 46, 49, 51
militia ... 14, 23, 26, 27, 44, objection ... 4, 6, 10, 12
otherwise ... 7, 9, 56, 59 54, 57-59 prior ... 19
53 objections ... 4, 5
overpassionate ... 41 personality ... 21, 38, 60 prison ... 19, 52, 62
mine ... 32 objective ... 27, 34
overreached ... 57 persons ... 58 Prisons ... 61
mines ... 52 objectively ... 38
A & T TRANSCRIPTS
70
U.S. v. Cox, 3:11-cr-00022-01-RJB
1/8/13 - index
resolve ... 4 search ... 28, 32 silencer ... 14, 15, 23

prize ... 52 rebutted ... 33
resolved ... 16, 20 searches ... 28 silencers ... 14, 27, 33, 42-44
probation ... 3, 4, 6, 7, 17, receive ... 61
respect ... 7, 9, 11, 15, 17, seated ... 3, 36, 46, 51 similar ... 7, 11, 61
19, 34, 39, 42, 52 received ... 3, 11, 28, 54, 56
18, 20, 24, 25, 28, 32, Seattle ... 37 similarly ... 55, 57, 58
problem ... 35, 54, 61 receiver ... 33
60 second ... 4, 6, 19, 23, 28, simple ... 29
problems ... 22 recent ... 42
respects ... 12, 59 33, 55, 60 simply ... 13, 16, 46, 52, 57
Proceedings ... 63, 64 recessed ... 36, 51
responsibilities ... 55 seconds ... 5 single ... 37
prognosis ... 39 recite ... 61
responsibility ... 15, 21, 25, secrete ... 42 sit ... 40
promote ... 60 recognize ... 8, 59
32 security ... 11 sits ... 22
proper ... 57, 58 recognized ... 38
result ... 19, 25, 32, 47, 53 see ... 5, 15, 18, 41, 45, 47, Sitting ... 26, 28, 34, 36, 43,
property ... 11 recommendation ... 3, 25,
results ... 39, 50, 60 50, 57 48
proportion ... 40 26, 34
retired ... 22 seeing ... 37 situated ... 55
propose ... 61 recommendations ... 52
Reverend ... 49 seek ... 13 situation ... 47, 48, 60, 61
prosecuting ... 57 recommended ... 52
rewrite ... 5 seeking ... 40 six ... 8, 10, 18, 19, 25, 37
prosecution ... 57 recorded ... 14
rhetoric ... 58 seen ... 12, 21, 22, 24, 32, 44 skeptical ... 50
protect ... 60 recording ... 64
rig ... 42 sees ... 41 SKROCKI ... 3, 4, 6, 7, 9,
protected ... 60 recordings ... 14, 20, 23,
rightfully ... 10 senior ... 29 11, 13, 17, 19, 20, 36,
protection ... 40 24, 28, 29, 31, 37
rise ... 3, 35, 36, 51, 63 sent ... 27, 42 38, 47, 63
provide ... 21, 54, 60 reduce ... 34
rises ... 14 sentenced ... 42, 48, 61 slippery ... 15, 16
provided ... 9, 13, 20, 22, 37, referenced ... 13
risk ... 11 sentences ... 52 slope ... 15, 16
44, 57 references ... 20
road ... 23, 29 sentencing ... 3, 4, 9, 12, 14, small ... 15
provides ... 41 refers ... 8
robbery ... 10 20-22, 27, 28, 31-35, soapbox ... 29
psychological ... 53, 60 reflect ... 5, 60
Robert ... 3 51, 52, 54, 55, 57, 60, society ... 31, 45
psychologist ... 37, 39, 54 regain ... 48
Robin ... 37 61 soldier ... 27, 34
public ... 9, 57, 60-62 regimen ... 41
role ... 16-19, 32 sentiments ... 40 solicitated ... 58
pulled ... 27 register ... 15
rule ... 4, 5, 7 separate ... 10 solicitation ... 9-11
punishment ... 45, 60 rehabilitated ... 41, 42
rules ... 19 serious ... 12, 37, 38, 41, 45, solicited ... 58, 59
pure ... 45 rehabilitation ... 31, 36
run ... 48 48, 59, 61 solid ... 36
puts ... 4, 16 release ... 62
running ... 23, 47, 49 seriousness ... 45, 60 solution ... 35
putting ... 44 reliable ... 57
runs ... 55, 56 served ... 61, 62 solutions ... 35
Q relic ... 14
ruse ... 43 service ... 53 somewhat ... 4
qualified ... 53 relied ... 21
S Services ... 34, 40 son ... 40, 41
R reluctant ... 39
sad ... 55 session ... 3, 36, 51 sooner ... 39
raised ... 4, 6, 7, 16, 32, 36, rely ... 9
safe ... 30 set ... 59 sorts ... 15
54 remains ... 51
safety ... 20 several ... 17, 36, 46 sought ... 23
raises ... 60 remedied ... 28
sat ... 13, 14, 25, 32, 56 shakes ... 61 sound ... 58, 64
ran ... 31 remorse ... 21
satisfied ... 18, 60 shifts ... 15 sounded ... 45, 47
range ... 19, 27, 61 remove ... 45, 47
save ... 20 shocking ... 25 sounds ... 37
rather ... 17, 18, 57, 58 renounced ... 31
saw ... 17, 22, 44, 45, 48, 57 shootout ... 41 speakers ... 34
rational ... 40 renunciation ... 25
scare ... 49 shot ... 28 speaks ... 20
reached ... 29, 61 report ... 3-7, 12, 13, 17,
scared ... 31, 47, 49 showed ... 38, 41, 42 special ... 62
reacted ... 40 19-22, 25, 31, 34, 38,
scary ... 48 showing ... 54, 57, 58 specific ... 7, 55
reacting ... 37 39, 41, 50
Schaeffer ... 3 shown ... 57 specificity ... 30
realizing ... 48 reports ... 21, 23
schizophrenia ... 21, 38 shows ... 40 speculation ... 43
reason ... 8, 9, 11, 16, 25, 27, request ... 20, 62, 63
school ... 14 shrapnel ... 28 speech ... 15, 52
35, 40, 43, 54, 56 require ... 62
scintilla ... 30 shut ... 52 speeches ... 22, 34, 37, 44
reasonable ... 16, 59 required ... 9, 14, 58
scored ... 38 side ... 38, 58 spite ... 60
reasonably ... 54 requires ... 57, 58
scoring ... 38 sign ... 62, 63 stage ... 21
reasons ... 15, 35, 54 reread ... 11
seal ... 13, 20 significant ... 22, 33 stand ... 7, 21, 23, 29, 57
rebuttal ... 35 research ... 27
A & T TRANSCRIPTS
71
U.S. v. Cox, 3:11-cr-00022-01-RJB
1/8/13 - index
time ... 6, 7, 10, 12, 23, unanimously ... 58, 59 walk ... 48
stark ... 43 supporters ... 41
25-28, 33, 35-38, 42, uncertainty ... 46 Wall ... 26
start ... 23 supports ... 58
44-46, 51, 53, 61 understates ... 58 wants ... 22
started ... 37, 40, 47, 52 surprising ... 52
times ... 7, 21, 24, 29 understood ... 39, 45 War ... 14, 26, 43
starting ... 37, 47 surveillance ... 18
Title ... 59 unfair ... 57 warfare ... 25
starts ... 41 susceptible ... 40
today ... 4, 22-24, 30, 31, 54 unidentified ... 17 warranted ... 55
state ... 13, 22, 24, 26, 30, sympathy ... 55
took ... 39 United ... 3, 8, 31, 32, 36, warrants ... 32
31, 34, 37, 42, 43 system ... 27, 34, 46, 56
51, 58, 59 wash ... 25
statements ... 4, 5, 20, 29, T topic ... 29
total ... 61 unknown ... 26, 33 washes ... 25
31, 33, 34, 60 tag ... 24
touch ... 31 Unless ... 15, 55 Washington ... 37
status ... 7-9, 53, 60 taking ... 22, 29, 51
towards ... 30, 61 unrelated ... 17 watched ... 13
statute ... 8, 9, 59, 60 Talley ... 9
track ... 17 untruths ... 16 watches ... 57
stay ... 29, 46 target ... 30
tractor ... 42 unusual ... 48, 52 ways ... 8, 44, 54
stayed ... 34 team ... 18, 40
trade ... 33 urge ... 13, 35 weapons ... 12, 15, 18, 29,
STEN ... 14, 24 technically ... 19
traffic ... 24, 30 uses ... 10 35, 44, 52, 58
step ... 21 tedious ... 4
trailer ... 32, 42 using ... 10, 26, 40 wearing ... 10, 26
Steve ... 23, 47 teenager ... 37
trained ... 53 utmost ... 29 week ... 37
Stick ... 23 telling ... 14, 30, 35, 41, 57
stories ... 15 tells ... 28 training ... 60 V weeks ... 25
Transcriber ... 64 vacuum ... 25 welcome ... 53
straightened ... 49 Teresa ... 64
transcript ... 64 vague ... 20 Whack ... 23
strength ... 26, 34 term ... 10, 60, 61
transcripts ... 36, 38 valid ... 39 whatsoever ... 37
strong ... 40, 46 terms ... 13, 21, 23-25, 27,
treated ... 59 valued ... 29 Whereas ... 34
stronger ... 28 28, 32, 37, 42, 45, 62
treatment ... 45, 60 variance ... 61 wherewithal ... 44, 49
strongly ... 12, 59 terrible ... 39
trial ... 5, 7, 12, 13, 15, 16, vehicle ... 28 whole ... 15, 38, 46, 49, 51,
struck ... 37 terrific ... 6
20, 22, 25, 32, 36, 38, vehicles ... 28 56
structure ... 31, 34 terrified ... 48, 49
53, 56, 60 verdict ... 3, 13 wide ... 56
struggle ... 12 terror ... 26
Trina ... 30, 49 Vernon ... 17, 26, 27, 34, 43, wife ... 39-41, 43, 45, 46, 50
study ... 53 test ... 14, 38
trooper ... 22, 30 44, 58, 61 will ... 16, 25, 43, 46, 50, 51,
stunning ... 13 testifies ... 12
trouble ... 27, 32, 37, 42, 54 version ... 12 56, 61, 62
submission ... 5, 7 testimony ... 12-15, 20, 32,
troubles ... 28 versus ... 3 willful ... 12, 13
submitted ... 26 33, 53, 56
truck ... 43 viable ... 28 willfully ... 13
subpart ... 56 tests ... 38
trucker ... 42 victim ... 8, 9, 19, 55 willfulness ... 16
subsection ... 18 theme ... 54-56
trust ... 49 victims ... 7-10, 55 wind ... 29
substantial ... 11, 61 thereby ... 33
trusted ... 28 view ... 5, 9, 15, 31, 40, 46, wisdom ... 34, 54
substantially ... 55, 61 therefore ... 16
truth ... 15, 57 53, 58 wish ... 6, 28, 39, 62, 63
substantive ... 10, 11 these ... 4, 6-8, 11, 12, 18,
TUESDAY ... 3 views ... 41 witness ... 13, 20, 33
subtheme ... 57 19, 21-29, 32-35, 37,
turn ... 4, 6, 20, 59 violated ... 42 witnesses ... 22
sue ... 26 41-45, 47, 53, 55-57
tutoring ... 14 violence ... 6, 11, 12, 35 women ... 32
suffering ... 38, 41 Thesing ... 17
twenties ... 37 violent ... 35 wonderful ... 49
sufficient ... 6, 45, 59 third ... 56, 60
twice ... 21, 23, 38 virtue ... 35 words ... 14, 45, 46, 53
suggested ... 5, 25, 33, 34, threat ... 20, 26, 31
two ... 4, 8, 13, 15, 16, 18, visited ... 26 wore ... 12
41, 53, 54 threaten ... 26
19, 28, 29, 32, 33, 45, vocational ... 60 work ... 21, 26, 35, 36
suggests ... 34 threatened ... 26, 45
48, 50, 58 voices ... 38 worked ... 14
suicide ... 43 threatening ... 45
types ... 4 volume ... 5, 6 worker ... 54
supervised ... 62 threatens ... 31
typically ... 58 voting ... 35 works ... 56
supervision ... 42, 45 threw ... 25
supplied ... 31 thump ... 31 tyranny ... 35 W workup ... 4
U wage ... 24 World ... 13, 14, 31, 40, 42,
supply ... 54 thwart ... 34
U.S. ... 30 Wainwright ... 40, 41 47, 50
support ... 22, 31, 46, 55, 59 ticket ... 30
ultimate ... 27 wake ... 48 worried ... 24
supported ... 59 ties ... 55
A & T TRANSCRIPTS
72
U.S. v. Cox, 3:11-cr-00022-01-RJB
1/8/13 - index
worse ... 47, 48, 50, 58, 59

worth ... 21, 49
wound ... 47
write ... 32
written ... 5, 7, 36, 43
wrote ... 17, 41, 53, 56
Y
year ... 50, 56
years ... 23, 25-27, 34-37,
46, 48, 50, 51, 62
yesterday ... 43, 61
young ... 37, 41, 45, 50
youthful ... 41
YouTube ... 28
A & T TRANSCRIPTS

605 Sentencing of Schaeffer Cox Transcript

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605 Sentencing of Schaeffer Cox Transcript

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1 UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT

2 FOR THE DISTRICT OF ALASKA

3 UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, ) Case 3:11-cr-00022-01-RJB

12 For the Plaintiff: STEVEN E. SKROCKI

16 For the Defendant: PETER A. CAMIEL

19 Probation Officer: CHARLENE HENSEL

22 Court Recorder: DENALI ELMORE

2 Transcription Service: A & T Transcripts

5 Proceedings recorded by electronic sound recording; transcript

1 ANCHORAGE, ALASKA - TUESDAY, JANUARY 8, 2013

3 (Call to Order of the Court at 9:27 a.m.)

6 States District Court for the District of Alaska is now in

7 session, the Honorable Robert J. Bryan presiding.

8 THE COURT: Please be seated. Good morning.

9 MR. SKROCKI: Good morning, Your Honor.

10 MS. LAMOUREUX: Good morning, Your Honor.

11 MR. CAMIEL: Morning, Your Honor.

12 THE COURT: This is cause number 11-22, United States

13 versus Francis Schaeffer Cox. Mr. Cox is present in court with

14 his attorney, Mr. Camiel. The government is here in the person

16 sentencing for the counts of conviction in the jury's verdict.

17 Mr. Cox, the first thing I must do is ask you if you

18 have received and read the presentence report and sentencing

19 recommendation from the probation officer.

20 THE DEFENDANT: Yes, I have, Your Honor.

21 THE COURT: And have you had the opportunity to discuss

22 those documents with Mr. Camiel?

23 THE DEFENDANT: Yes, I have.

24 THE COURT: Okay. Now, the first thing that we have to

25 do in this sentencing, as in any other, is to determine the

1 application of the guidelines. And I know there are a lot of

2 people here today interested in this matter. And the guideline

3 issues are sometimes somewhat tedious, but we have to go

4 through this and determine what the guidelines are before we

5 can turn to -- turn our attention to the actual sentencing

7 And in this case there have been filed a number of

8 objections to the guideline workup and to the presentence

9 report that the Court must resolve. I guess, first, the

10 objections filed really are in two categories. One is

11 regarding the factual statements made in the presentence report

12 and whether any of those should be omitted or changed or added

13 to. The second types of objections are to the application of

14 guideline workup. And I guess my first question to Mr. Camiel,

15 these are your -- well, maybe I should ask the government

16 first. I take it you have no objections to the probation

17 officer's report and guideline workup?

18 MR. SKROCKI: That's correct, we have no objection.

19 THE COURT: All right. And, Mr. Camiel, I guess that

20 puts the ball in your court in regard to the various objections

22 proceeding on this. Do you want to be heard on the various

23 issues raised regarding the factual content of the presentence

24 report, or do you want me to just rule on that stuff?

25 MR. CAMIEL: Your Honor, as to the factual objections

1 that don't affect the guidelines, I think we adequately

2 addressed that in our written submission, and so we're prepared

3 to have the Court just rule on those.

4 THE COURT: Okay. Well, I should say that I've read

5 everything filed, including all the letters and briefs and

6 everything that's been filed in this case, and of course also

7 recall the events of the trial.

8 Now, in regard to objections to the content of the

9 factual statements in the presentence report, I think it is not

10 necessary or appropriate for me to rewrite that in any general

11 way, which is sort of suggested by the volume of the objections

13 the others -- I'm looking at my notes here, counsel, to see if

14 there was anything here that I felt should be changed on the

15 basis of the objections made.