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Hey, this is Jay Valens from FastSeduction.com and we've got something
special for you. What you’re about to listen to is the first ever audio
Interview with Allen Reyes, better known as “Gunwitch” in the pickup
community. Not only is it a first ever interview with him, it's also in-person,
and done by none other than Ray Devans, better known as “TokyoPUA”.
It’s a terrific interview and one we're proud to be the first to bring you. So,
… sit back and enjoy, we've got more lined up, so check back at our site
and online store often.
FS101: OK, so here we are, it‟s September 12th here in the United States,
the year 2004, this is TokyoPUA talking here with Gunwitch.
GUNWITCH: Right.
FS101: It‟s been… I guess this is the first face to face meeting anyone
has had with you… it‟s been a long time coming.
FS101: Just for the people listening to this, I‟ll give you a sense of how
hard it was to get this interview. I just flew today from Taipei,
Taiwan through Tokyo, Japan into Portland, Oregon, drove though
Linn, Oregon, the “grass seed capital” of the world, into the
designated meeting point which is a Denny‟s here in Eugene, Oregon.
So that‟s what it‟s taken to meet one of the most famous guys in the
seduction community, Gunwitch, and I thought we would just get
started with an introduction about yourself, how long, say, you have
been involved in seducing women, and whatever else you want to say
about yourself, in terms of background, age, whatever, you know.
GUNWITCH: Well, I basically started out when I was 18. I had come
out of a long term relationship, and I couldn‟t get laid, or so I thought,
but the truth is, I mostly had just, hadn‟t been out, I kind of went into
a shell and stayed in my house. And I kind of realized, I realized
that hey, I haven‟t been laid because I haven‟t been meeting any
women. Spark right there, spark 1 for, you know, you gotta realize
you gotta get out and meet the women. I mean its half the battle, so I
went out and the first woman I approached at 18 years old, I believe
she was 23, I mean she was probably a 7 or an 8 on the looks scale.
I approached her, I basically did Gunwitch Method, and fucked her.
After that, you lead to 9 years later, I‟m writing Gunwitch Method, I
finally figured it all out, I probably got about 3,000 rejections under
my belt.
FS101: Its interesting that you state it that way, right, cause a lot of guys
GUNWITCH: Yeah, totally, and when I did this, like I said, the first
woman, I mean it was kind of like a gambler‟s rush, the first time you
ever gamble, and you win big, you‟re going to be a compulsive
gambler. And that‟s kind of what happened with me, I picked up
the first woman, and it was probably about 100 more women I had to
approach after that before I got laid again. But it was such an
addiction because it worked the first time.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, and it took a long time to get back to doing the
natural stuff at an analytical level. And that‟s kind of what, in my
new book, I wrote, it has all the missions, for each of the natural
components, or the RAP. Which is the Relaxation, Assumption of
rapport, Persistence (past the opener), then the second RAP that
you do, and you get all on autopilot is: Relaxation of outcome, then
Assumption of the sexual state, then Persistence to isolation. And
you get all of those in order and that‟s like your inner game, right
there, and then you‟re natural, I mean that‟s basically how, like you
just met my wingman, Steve Austin (I used to call him that on the
website).
FS101: Well, I think it doesn‟t help directly, but one thing I liked about
your book, is you talk about different activities you suggest to men to
do because it brings out your, I think you called it your “sun” you
know, sort of in essence your testosterone.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, and your sun comes through what you believe and
then what you really believe, plus, like your testosterone, your
masculinity, is projected in a manner that‟s like your shadow, that‟s
what I call it. Your shadow is the actions you take purposefully.
But if your sun isn‟t there, you‟re going to have a weak shadow, the
actions you take won‟t be congruent. And that‟s basically I think to
sum up pick up, how I do it, really quickly with that, in that you do
the sun, you get your sun down, and you get your body, which is your
mind in this metaphor, which is kind of confusing but, and that‟s
what you think, and then you project from that, and you project this
masculinity, and this congruence, and this presence, this character,
that‟s so strong, the girl will state match you. Then you go into the
GUNWITCH: Yeah, they don‟t want to feel like a slut, even if they are
super attracted to you, so you take accountability by persisting, and
you‟ve got all that in place, what more do you need? It‟s amazing,
you know, it took me a long time to figure it out, but its really an easy
concept, that people match those that are more dominant than them,
because they go submissive, so they match that person‟s mannerisms,
characters, and gestures, everything. Boom, you go into the sexual
state, they follow you into it, you got „em,
FS101: I can say for the people listening to this that Gunwitch definitely
has a presence here, I mean we are just sitting here in a rental car,
but you are definitely projecting just by your posture, you are taking
up a lot of room and you are gesturing, and uh, and I could see just
how powerful that would be, your affect on women.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, you know, I mean to other men its kinda, I‟m just
a nice guy, I mean I‟m not a fucking freak or nothing, but with
women, yeah, it‟s more like they go more submissive, but I kind of
come off, I mean I don‟t come off like the main character of a movie,
I kind of come off like the bad guy in a B movie.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, and they kinda match that, and they eventually get
to where I‟ll notice them starting to kinda mimic me, and they‟ll, they
wanna kind of try and be like me, so they will, they are obviously into
my state, they‟re gonna to match whatever I do. That‟s when I‟ll do
the sexuality part, which will be like, you know, I will soften my tone
more and more. Like right now, like if I was talking to you, and let‟s
say you are a woman, (laughs), you know I don‟t wanna be weird but,
just to demonstrate to you
FS101: No, that‟s cool, it‟s all about demonstrating the method
GUNWITCH: Yeah, like you know, I would be talking to you like this,
and I would be looking at you, and I would soften my tone more, and
once you started to reciprocate a little more I would, you know, I
would put my hand on you and you know, maybe go “hey come over
here, I wanna whisper something to you”, get in your ear, and I
would get more soft with them, and then they would go more soft too,
which is like, its sexual state, but I have to come with like kind of a
soft sexual state. Because I‟m kind of big and imposing, if I get on a
girl too much, they get scared,
FS101: OK, so this is something you have tailor made to your, your own,
well, physique as it were.
FS101: We were talking about that earlier, about just tailor making you
know, your method around certain things about you personally.
[ Editing Note: referring to “you” here as any guy in general, not
just Gunwitch ]
FS101: But that is a good point you bring up there, because you know, if
you are losing sight of the fact that it‟s a give and take thing, I mean
hey, you are both getting pleasure from it, why is it that so many guys
are out there going out and throwing down the big bucks on it and
stuff.
GUNWITCH: And a lot of the times those guys don‟t even get laid.
And the thing that I find too, is women, who do you hear say the
word “slut” and “whore” the most? Women? They use it to berate
women who aren‟t going with the code, who aren‟t making men do
things for them, before they have sex with them. Because they‟re
ruining it for the rest of them. You see, there‟s women out there
who will have sex with men just out of pure lust, and they say
outright, “I‟m a horny bitch”, this pisses the chicks off, other chicks.
They say “Oh, she‟s such a slut, she‟s such a pig” because they are
screwing up their deal. Yeah, them kind of women are evolving out
of that, they think… a lot of times the really good looking women,
they are more fit, you know, they are better breeding stock kind of,
they‟re more capable of making their own living, of making their own
way. And them are the kind of women you do find that tend to be
more horny, and they will have sex with guys without having to go
through all the little bullshit games. And other women, that pisses
them off because they are like, hey, she is screwing up our deal, we
get all this free shit, now she is giving out sex for free, and she looks
better than us, she‟s a slut. And then they downgrade her, and
FS101: I‟d say personally one thing you have to get over as a guy
wanting to become a pickup artist is, you know, this idea of either
jealousy or that kind of viewpoint. I mean you are going to have to
view at some point that some of the girls you are going to get with are
going to get with other guys, that is the way sex works. Like you
said, it‟s a dick and a vagina and they can go together and it can
happen in a lot of different combinations.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, its not uh… I found it kinda of jades you a little bit
when you have sex with a woman for the first time and maybe she is
a really cool chick and you are thinking of having a long term
relationship, I always kind of think to myself, this isn‟t the first dick
that has been in here, it ain‟t going to be the last. She is probably
going to have sex with somebody else again, it kind of jades things, I
guess, I‟m not a relationship expert
GUNWITCH: But overall it makes it to where you don‟t get hurt, cause
guys are like “Oh my god, she had sex with some other guy” but it‟s a
FS101: There‟s a whole lot of genetic and evolutional reasons for why
we get jealous. Back a million years ago, or even 100,000 years ago,
the whole purpose of sife was to stay alive, and stay alive long enough
to do the second purpose in life, which is to have kids, to be immortal,
and you‟re programmed that way, but you know if some guy was out
on the hunt, and you know, while he was gone, his wife or mate had
sex with another guy, you know, and he‟s spending all his hard time
out there bringing back the deer, then during that two weeks she has
somebody else‟s baby, you know, jealousy was a useful thing back
then, but its not too useful these days, you know, there‟s you know,
condoms and stuff…
FS101: If you are going to be a pick up artist, my feeling is you gotta get
around the jealousy because women will smell that on you and that‟s
when they start digging into you with these thing like you know, we
were talking about, like we were talking about, like they need to get
your resources.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, you don‟t want to go along with that program, you
don‟t want to fit yourself into that model, of the survival and the uh,
the resources, and being a provider, and all that shit, you don‟t want
to fit yourself into that frame, by showing jealousy and showing ego,
about them having sex with another man, or you‟re just fitting
yourself right into the whole models.
FS101: Speaking of you know, not fitting into those models, you
mentioned to me earlier, you know, that you never really have been
on a date, as such.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, you know, its amazing, I hear about them, I mean.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, I‟ve been on dates with women, I mean I went out
with my girlfriends, I went to the bar with them, I‟ve even bought
women drinks, but I‟ve never uh, yeah, I‟ve never went out with a
woman, or met a woman then went out with her, then had sex with
her. It just doesn‟t happen, I don‟t know where this frame comes
from… maybe, living in a smaller town, it might be, kind of more of…
you can have more same day sex. But it‟s uh, I even wrote that into
my book, some guys may need to do phone number routes, they may
be busy, they might also uh, may want to meet women the next day
or two days later or something. But I myself personally, and my
wing, he was saying it too, we don‟t uh, we just don‟t see this, it‟s
almost always the same day, people have sex.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, it‟s uh, I more adopted it from the parties and stuff,
you know when I was a teenager, and I got into my early twenties, I‟d
be in a lot of social circle parties, and I could have sex with women
the same night, right there at the party, or maybe they‟d come home
with me, from the party, and it just was always kind of my frame, and
just how it happened, I never really thought about it much, until I
found the Fast Seduction website, and everything, and that‟s uh, its
kinda, some guys are doing the phone number thing, and I‟d seen
that in movies, guys asking for chicks numbers, and I thought, that‟s
kind of corny, you know, and what‟s the point of all that. I actually
have done some number closing and gotten numbers… probably
have about 300 number closes under my belt, none of them ever
panned out, none of them every went anywhere, so… I‟m abandoning
that!
FS101: Go with what works! Well that‟s interesting for all the guys
listening because it‟s uh… I think for those of us who have become
very successful, you know, we fortunately had certain environments
that forced that on us. Like I mean, I got to Tokyo, and people were
telling me you know, “all you have to do is get a girl back to your
place and she‟ll put out for you”. Well, it wasn‟t actually the case,
but I believed that, and so I started doing it, and you know, that‟s
how I started isolating, and then that was the frame for me, it‟s lucky
you had sort of your own party thing, and I think you know it‟s
interesting, it‟s one of those, the haves and the have nots, you know, I
mean for the guys who do get laid a lot, you know, then it‟s an easy,
repeatable structure, once you start doing it. And if you haven‟t,
you know, then you are repeating the same thing that isn‟t getting
you anywhere.
FS101: Well, it‟s still worthwhile… That same concept applies to what
we‟re talking about earlier, it‟s just that for guys sitting there right
now listening to this and thinking like “Oh, TokyoPUA and Gunwitch,
these guys you know, they get laid a lot”, but maybe they‟re worried
about just being able to approach in the first place, but the same
thing is true for even the smaller steps of getting to the lays, like just
starting to approach. If you do it once, and you find and you get one
that is successful, at least to the point where she finally talks to you,
then you lose your fear of the other stuff, at least temporarily, maybe
it come back on another day, but as you were saying, “wash, rinse,
repeat” you know, and you build yourself up. That‟s one thing I
liked about your book you know, you start out with your missions
and stuff, and you build it up into a bigger structure to where
finally…
GUNWITCH: Yeah, somebody said its like, you kind of wing it until
you get lucky a few times, is kind of a good method, „cause then you
get lucky several times, then you see the process. Its probably the
quickest way to become a pickup artist, is to just wing it, and just
approach tons and tons of chicks. But having some structure
behind it is a really good idea too, because I mean I look at myself,
took me about 9 years to come up with Gunwitch Method, which, if
I‟d had Gunwitch Method on day one, I‟m pretty sure I would have
been as good as I am now, by year one or year two, rather than taking
9 years. But, you can, once you have some amount of material, you
need some kind of structures, at least, you know, stuff from like the
manual from FastSeduction.com, and use that as your structure, and
try and work the chicks through that, see what works for you, what
doesn‟t. Get your uh, initial, you know, your few pick ups – the
evidence of the success, and you‟re gonna have, your gonna have the
fire going then. Then unless you give it up for some reason and end
up in a relationship, which that can really stunt you, them
relationships…
FS101: Right.
FS101: All right, wanted to add some personal side to this whole
interview, because part of it, you know, guys are getting some good
information from this, but, you know, you have been one of the most
mysterious of the group because no one had ever met you before.
GUNWITCH: Yeah.
FS101: OK. You know, I think you mentioned in a post recently you‟ve
been with over 100 women, and I was just wondering if there was
one to you that was the most memorable, maybe it was there was
one…
GUNWITCH: My ex, my last ex, definitely, she threw me off the top of
her car in a parking lot, it was that intense, it was the most
memorable chick moment of my entire life. We got in an argument,
and she storms out and tried to leave me at the fucking store, and I‟m
a big guy, I don‟t walk, so I jumped on top of the car. The fucking
crazy bitch spun a doughnut and threw me off the car 15 or 20 feet,
so yeah, that‟s the most memorable. As far as romance goes,
definitely the first girl I was with, and falling in love and all that, that
was a pretty intense thing, it was the first time actually loving a girl
that you‟re having sex with. Too much almost.
FS101: So you are not immune to love just like the rest of us, you can
always catch it.
FS101: Persistence, just for the record on my side, has always been a big
thing, and uh, you know I learned it through other areas, and uh, I
was actually a member of a fraternity in college where they forced
you to memorize a quote by Calvin Coolidge, one of the former
presidents of the United States, called “Persistence”, and you know,
FS101: Its interesting in your book you like uh, cite that… I don‟t know,
it was like the year 1940 when shit started going wrong in terms of
social conditioning, maybe where men lost persistence.
FS101: I agree, and that is one thing I liked about your book, you know,
I have read tons of books on the subject myself, and one thing you
went out and said is “go out and find yourself some activity that
forces you into you know, challenge, win loss situation”, basically you
are telling guys to get something that is going to boost their
testosterone. You know, they have a choice from among different
things, but uh, you are exactly right, the average guy these days is a
wimp in a lot of ways, and need something to go to…
GUNWITCH: Yeah, uh, guy from down in Texas works with uh, Real
Social Dynamics, he‟s uh, Herbal is his name, and he does uh, you
know like professional gambling and uh, you know, that kind of thing.
And he‟s not a big guy or a masculine dude, he‟s not a burly fucker,
but he probably gets some of that from that because like you say, it‟s
a win loss situation, and uh yeah, anything can really do it, you just
gotta have something that, the intensity is more than picking up
chicks. If you are in the boxing ring, its kind of like in Fight Club,
where he says, uh, in the movie Fight Club, he says uh, you know, it
kind of turns down everything else in your life when you are fighting
all the time. And just like you can maybe be gambling, you can
maybe be fighting, it can maybe be downhill skiing, just something,
so that chicks aren‟t the most exciting rush you get. You want
something that tunes them out a bit, makes them seem less
intimidating.
FS101: That‟s a good point. You know, I find uh, I‟m doing in my
professional life, you know, I am involved in well, a lot of things, but
there comes a point where we are selling these big, expensive
machines to multinational companies and you know, the package
deals can wind up where you are selling 4 to 5 to 6 million dollars
GUNWITCH: Shit she has seen on TV. Haha, we said it at the same
time!
FS101: Exactly! You know, and suddenly you feel a little bit, call it
“above her”, maybe that is a bad way to put it, but you are coming
from a point of power where, say she is giving you some stupid shit
test, where you know, like, to see if you pass it… all that loses its
significance when you have just been out the day before trying to get
something like that. And whether it‟s gambling, or…
GUNWITCH: And again, she‟s turned down, you are turned up, she is
going to match you. It‟s the same… that is the whole nature of
women, is that they need to be submissive. And most men are
totally against that, they won‟t try to make a woman submissive. So
that doesn‟t… so they never end up picking them up. They never
end up getting the attraction, because she never goes submissive,
they never go sexual, and it never links up.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, it‟s a synergy, is what I like to call it, you know, it‟s
like a synergy of several things have to come together. And that‟s
why, sometimes guys are naturals, because sometimes they just put
up all that together normally. And, they don‟t use a certain verbal
technique or anything, they just project that, that confidence, that
willpower, the persistence… you know, the masculine man. And
women submit to that. And sometimes you think a guy is kind of a
goof, or something. Its kind of… I talk about it in my book, with the
“star” I talk about at the end of it. Which is like… when you‟ve
totally got your character down, you can add a niche to it, you can be
GUNWITCH: Yeah. But women don‟t like the idea of that. But who
do they have sex with?
FS101: On the other hand, they are feeling and they actually relate to it.
FS101: You know, definitely through your writings and now seeing you
in person, it‟s very clear that you‟re very much of a self-made man.
You‟ve got success in your own personal business and now you‟re
writing your book, it‟s very successful…
pause/edit
FS101: One of the things that was most influential to me was just uh,
the readings that I did in mASF and such. And you know, I could
give a shit whether a lot of those guys who I read from actually got
laid themselves, but the fact is that what they wrote got me laid,
and…
GUNWITCH: Yeah, that is what I love to look at too, is they lay reports
with my method (on mASF). It really gives me a lot of pride, you
know, it makes me feel good. I‟m like the de-virginator, you know, I
got… more guys have been de-virginated using my stuff than I‟ve
seen anybody else‟s, you know, and its like, stuff like that makes me
feel good, you know, I‟m getting that going, and yeah, a lot of people
demand too much proof…
FS101: And I can see there is some point where you want to see, does
that guy actually get laid, but to obsess on it is a little bit too much.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, it‟s pretty blatant, I mean if, assuming I‟ve never
been laid, looking at me right now, its pretty amazing I have made up
a fucking method that hundreds of guys are getting laid with. I
think that‟s pretty impossible. If I knew absolutely nothing about
women, how in the hell did I make up this method that…
FS101: Maybe if I could sum it up, there‟s kind of like a cliché, the
saying that “the best way to learn is through teaching”
FS101: I guess I can uh, kind of relate to that, I mean uh, I spend a lot
less time posting and on chats obviously, but there is.. just by sort of
having gotten renown as being TokyoPUA there‟s times where you
know, you are dealing with a woman and things aren‟t going very
well, and its just like, does this girl have any idea who she is dealing
with? And then I kick it in gear and, boom, take things higher.
GUNWITCH: You know its extreme for me because its like, I forget
what Jay was saying, you know like, maybe 500,000 people know
who I am, know about my methods and stuff. You know, I am
probably up there with like, literally, somebody thinks about
seduction, a human male, they may think Casanova, then Don Juan,
and then Gunwitch, and its kind of strange, yeah, because I will be
sitting there thinking… Just last night I told some people there in uh,
Eugene, told „em, “I‟m Gunwitch, from Fast Seduction”. And they
are like “what?” And I‟m like “Go check it out! I‟m fucking
famous!” And I‟m just fucking with them, you know.
FS101: But it is interesting, you know, if you think about in this day and
age, what I like to say about our site, Fast Seduction 101, is that it‟s
where Casanova meets the internet. It‟s like, people like you, have
always existed throughout history, but very few people have had
access to them.
FS101: So that is where people are really fortunate now, you know, I
mean its like all the stuff dear old dad should have taught you but
never did. And now the guys who know a lot you can have access to.
In general, let‟s talk about, there‟s a lot of methods out there, and
some of them are technique based and stuff, but the thing I like
FS101: OK, yeah, yeah. I guess I use a more euphemistic term for it, but
anyway, that when you walk behind a girl and just you know, she‟s
wearing a short skirt, or she has a nice ass, and you let the masculine
side of you come out, and you just chase and its kind of primal and
uh,
GUNWITCH: Yeah, I like the kind of biological side of it, more than
social, the social side of it, I don‟t wanna wow her, I wanna make her
clit tingle. That‟s what I want, you know, I don‟t want her to think I
am cool, I want her to wanna fuck me. It‟s my whole thing, that‟s
what separates my method from a lot of other methods is I don‟t
want her to fuck me „cause I am cool, I want her to fuck me because
she‟s hot, and she‟s hot for me. That is where I wanna go, I don‟t
wanna…
FS101: And the sex is better at that point. I think about this, and how
lucky I am compared to a guy like Bill Gates. That guy might be
able to get a lot more pussy than I can by virtue of having a bankroll
that is you know, massive, but I think a lot of those women would
enjoy sex with me a hell of a lot more than with him, it doesn‟t matter.
There is a point there where her being hot for you is …
GUNWITCH: Yeah.
FS101: (laughing) Ah, that‟s excellent, “slaying dragons”. But no, its
true, I think like Jay was talking with his dad for example about what
his is doing, and his dad can‟t believe it, its like “what‟s so hard about
it”? And that is a strange thing, but that is what society has
developed, it is hard for some guys.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, it‟s hard for some guys and uh, yeah, its once you
understand the dynamics of it, just get out there and work „em its not
that fucking hard, its just a lot of guys either won‟t get out there and
work „em, or are scared to get out there and work them, don‟t even
know about the dynamics, or uh, are in a whole different set of
dynamics. Thinking, I gotta make a whole lot of money, I gotta be
super fit, you know, instead of going with the human dynamics of it
and working them. They‟re trying to attract women, with uh,
anything else, they are trying to make it too easy is what it is, they
want it too damn easy, and they are willing to work super hard to
FS101: …there was guys out on roller blades, you know the business
majors, no offense to you guys who are business majors, but you got
the fucking engineers sitting there in the library, you know uh,
busting their ass, but never get any pussy, and its like, at some point
in your life, you gotta look at, what is your goal, and really because of
biology a lot of your goal is to get laid by hot women, and if whatever
you are doing now isn‟t doing that, you know, I mean, you gotta do
something differently and certainly, your book and your method is a
quick way to get to that.
GUNWITCH: Thanks. Yeah, the uh… yeah, just having these guys
laying on the beach, surf bums, they may have no job prospects, but
they may end up fucking 50, 100 women in their life, but some guy
works his fucking ass to the bone, ends up with a trophy wife, has sex
with a couple of other women that he dated… I mean that beach
bum has a little more together, you know! He‟s not really
contributing as much to society, but he‟s contributing more to
himself.
FS101: And you got to ask yourself at some point, how much of a
hedonist are you, I found out I‟m pretty much a hedonist. You
know, I still work 80 hours a week, but I have become very efficient
at least at meeting that goal, and uh you know uh…
FS101: I go for the same day as much as possible but in the worst case, I
will… I mean it‟s a special dynamic that may be special to Tokyo and
not applicable to half the guys on this planet because you can call the
girl 6 months later and she‟s on.
FS101: Well that can happen anywhere, and I don‟t know what‟s up
with that, I think women you know like you were saying, the ideal
thing is when you can get to sex with them the first day and you‟ve
given them that excuse you know where you are taking the
responsibility, but after that point, they are sitting there thinking to
themselves “Oh, my God, what did I do”, you‟ve got to not let them
have time to go through that whole thought process.
FS101: And if they bring in another girl to talk about it with, you know,
they don‟t want to look like a slut .. That was one thing I really liked
about your book, it was just this particular realization, you had where,
you know, I think we all know women don‟t want to be called sluts,
but you said… you made it even more intense in that you said, “it‟s
not just that they don‟t want to be thought of as sluts, like they say
„that would suck‟, but actually they truly, seriously fear that shit.”
FS101: laughs
GUNWITCH: Yeah.
FS101: Let‟s step through one given seduction that you went through,
like I mean lets verbalize one of your lay reports, one that I recently
may have commented on myself, I forget, I think maybe there was
some point where you met her and she was looking at candy canes.
FS101: Let‟s start from the top on that one, „cause that was a good one.
GUNWITCH: That was, I went down to the local mall, and she was
sitting there on a stool type of thing, like a barbers chair thing in a
hair shop. So I did kind of a hover thing, I didn‟t really hover, but I
kind of walked around, I went over and looked at their hair care
products, even though I didn‟t really want it, and I was still checking
FS101: That‟s an important part right there, you‟ve got to see if the girl
is cool or not and…
GUNWITCH: Yeah, and she wasn‟t like fucking “who are you?”
FS101: That is one thing you say in your book, many guys are like
thinking that they are going to go up and it‟s going to be some kind of
crazy reaction, but the average woman are going to be a little bit
happy. I hate to keep asking questions, but did this girl have, you
mentioned you do a lot of screening for how a girl is dressed, did this
girl dress in a way that you felt you might be successful?
FS101: I remember you saying that she was your “10”. Because a big
part of your method, you are going for girls who are your type. It‟s
not like some guys who just go for Pamela Anderson.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, I kind of go for girls that are like pale, and have
like really black black long straight hair.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, and we get shit like that going and uh, she was
waiting to get her hair done, so I went and read a book, there is like a
Waldenbooks kitty corner to it, I was over there and I think I came
back and uh, was waiting when she was done, and that is when the
whole lollypop incident happened, and I was just fucking around
with her, busting her chops, and uh, after that, we just went down…
it was kind of more of a hookup kind of a pickup at that time, it
wasn‟t really much to tell, it was really kind of standard,
GUNWITCH: Yeah, just basically you do stuff like that and uh, I forget,
I think I lied
GUNWITCH: The happy hour, oh, I always do that, I always tell chicks
“It‟s happy hour”. Yeah, and they don‟t fucking know. (laughing)
FS101: So, you and I know what you‟re talking about, basically you told
her it was happy hour, but it was more like 2 in the afternoon or
something it was an excuse to go to the bar.
FS101: You guys got there and she‟s like “it‟s not happy hour” and
you‟re like “Oh, I guess I was wrong”
FS101: You guys took separate cars, too, that was an interesting part for
me. You let her out of your site. You had to, it sounded like, in
that case.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, I mean, shit, I‟ve been really rusty lately just in
general because working so much on the website and all that. Like
last night going out in Eugene, there, it was like I was just kinda
piddling around, there wasn‟t reallymany women I was attracted to,
either.
FS101: That‟s one big part of it, I mean, doesn‟t matter how good your
technique is, if the girls don‟t interest you, there goes the sexual state
part of that, so your method, any method, is going to have a problem
with that.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, I just didn‟t really have much interest last night,
plus, yeah, I‟m just rusty. Haven‟t, ah, don‟t really care for the clubs,
either, and it was a super loud club. But yeah, I mean, If I just do
street..
FS101: Like you said at the beginning of this interview, “I‟ve had 3,000
rejections”
FS101: I think they say a similar statistic about Michael Jordan, like, or
someone, you know, he‟s got all the statistics for most games won but
he said he‟s also, you know, lost more or been handed the ball to win
the game and lost it more times than everyone else. He was always
entrusted with it, but that‟s another reason why he got better, but it‟s
the same thing.
GUNWITCH: Babe Ruth was like the home run king and everything,
but he also struck out more than everybody else. Yeah, it‟s all about
your sex life not about being the best Pickup Artist, it‟s about having
a good sex life for yourself and enjoying yourself in everything, I
think it‟s that way. Not being the best, not being outcome oriented,
but being mastery oriented. You want to master things not depend
on the outcome to make you feel good.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, It‟s more of a martial arts that I‟ve come to that.
In martial arts they, it‟s like they say, you know, you can‟t be
outcome dependant on winning this match, you know, win this
boxing match, win this Judo, you know, winning this Randori session.
You can‟t can‟t be dependent on that. You have to think in terms of
“this is part of my mastery”, part of the mastery is doing this, doing
the sparring, doing, you know, the Randori. That‟s the way to go for
it, not sit and think “oh, I gotta fucking have a, I gotta beat this guy
or else I‟m not worthwhile”. No, it‟s not about that, it‟s especially
not about that in the pickup community, as far as I‟m concerned.
It‟s not about being better than some other pickup artist.
FS101: Yeah, no, that‟s, I agree with you there. I mean, you can get
caught up a lot in, you know, trying to be like some other guy, it‟s the
same thing as trying to beat the Joneses, you know, someone gets a
better car then you, next, it‟s always a never-ending battle and that‟s
where…
GUNWITCH: Yeah, you just gotta get what‟s satisfying to you. That‟s
the way to live in my book and especially in pickup, „cause it‟s all
about your satisfaction at the end of the day.
FS101: You know, there was one thing that was interesting to me about
your book and maybe the way you developed your method, but, at
one point you kinda stripped everything down, it‟s like you almost
threw out everything you knew and then started to start with the
fundamentals and it was similar to me, I‟m not sure if I‟m
remembering the exact guy, but like, I think it was Descartes who is
one of the famous French mathematicians, also philosopher, he did
something like that early on, too, he was like, he wanted to sort of
form his theory about the world and then he like, he just assumed
nothing, then he started building on little blocks. I don‟t know why
but when I read your book I had this feeling of like that that‟s what
you were doing. I was wondering if you were philosophy based or…
FS101: Did you ever read, what was it, like Dianetics or any of that stuff.
GUNWITCH: Oh, yeah, yeah, the Scientology thing, yeah I read that,
yeah.
FS101: You might wonder how I knew that, but just reading your book
there was one point in there where you said “If you don‟t understand
even one word, go back and look it up” and the only place I‟d ever
heard that in the whole, you know, all of my readings was reading
Dianetics.
GUNWITCH: But, no, I did read that, and that did strike me that that‟s
a good thing. Rather than letting somebodh skim over a whole
sentence „cause they don‟t understand a word, it is a good idea, have
them look it up. Because then they learn that
GUNWITCH: Yeah.
FS101: Yeah, that was new. Like that was stuff you don‟t find in the
free version.
GUNWITCH: No, yeah, that‟s totally different. I mean, it‟s stuff like
FS101: You talked in the original method and also in the book about
selling a better product, so getting back to that looks scale. But one
thing that, you know, even myself, I got away from for a while, was,
you know, first you, before you find all this stuff, you know, you think,
like the rest of society, all right I gotta look my best and, you know,
maybe you‟ll focus on trying to look really good and you‟ll have zero
game. Then you find Fast Seduction 101 and you realize there‟s all
these techniques and you might actually go the other way and I
found myself, you know, worrying about learning all these various
things and then, you know, I let me looks go and then I still did
better because the techniques were good and the attitudes were good
but then, at the end of the day…
FS101: With the looks, right, and you know, you don‟t lie about that,
you say there‟s a lot of good things that you could do, you yourself
you found that, you know, when you cut down…
FS101: You know that if they‟re opening you, then 9‟s and 10‟s are
thinking about it, but they‟re too proud to.
FS101: They don‟t want to be seen with you because you‟re bigger.
GUNWITCH: But when I‟m trimmed up, it‟s more like the opposite.
It‟s like I‟m socially acceptable, especially in my area, „cause it‟s like
being bigger and shit is pretty fashionable
FS101: Remember what I said, think in the end, you know, it‟s more
about your method then all your competition, they‟ll be plenty of
guys thinking “who can pick up what”.
FS101: I figure me and Jay will be out there, too, and I really don‟t want
to get involved in that, I just wanna have fun. Why is it everyone
has to, you know, prove something there, but, uh…
GUNWITCH: Figure, the hell with it, though. May as well do it.
Have fun with it.
FS101: I mean, there‟s one of those things there, too, I mean, some of
these guys do have, are in this game for the game, they call it a game,
and you know, part of that, you know, beating the other guys is one
of those things of getting your sun, you know, getting the masculine
part and if that‟s what does it for you, then hey, that‟s part of the
game, then that‟s cool. For me, it‟s more about getting the kind of
chicks I like and I think it is for you, too.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, exactly. But, yeah, you get kinda talked down by
FS101: We should have some arm wrestling, I know you can beat all of
them there. “Ok, we‟re going to determine the best PUA by arm
wrestling”.
GUNWITCH: It‟s been good. You know, just teaching the stuff. Some
of the ego does come in with the other guys, and it‟s like, it doesn‟t, I
don‟t know, I mean, a lot of people tend to perceive it like I hate
these guys or something. But really, I mean, like I‟ve said, you
know, if I walked into a bar and I seen fucking Tyler or something,
TylerDurden getting kicked in the stomach or something by some
dude, I‟d beat the guys ass for him. But I‟ve seen this competition,
you know, surely from marketing wise and also pride wise, I want my
method to be the top method, and I want more people to try my
method. But I don‟t hate these guys in any way like, you know, like
as an enemy, as a real enemy or something. But a lot of people tend
to kinda take it that way, „cause it‟s “Oh, it‟s Gunwitch, he‟s the
violent, he‟s a loose cannon”. You know, it‟s stupid.
FS101: I mean, you know, guys have to understand that, you know, you
are kind a masculine guy so you don‟t take shit. That‟s one thing
that, you know, is congruent about you and your method, so that‟s
good. I mean, any guy who can bench what you can is probably not
gonna be the guy who‟s gonna say “Oh, I‟ll just lay down and take it”.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, that‟s one thing, I‟m not going be having guys
busting my chops or cock blocking me in any way. AMOGing me or
any of that shit. Competition-wise, hey I‟d have to show out what I
am. I mean, I wouldn‟t whip their ass or nothing, but I‟ll be like
“get the fuck outa here”. That‟s what I do in real life, tell „em to get
FS101: Yeah, I plan to, when I get a chance here, or maybe when I get
back to Tokyo, write up a post, and the title will probably be
“Gunwitch is real”. I now can validate that I‟ve met you and, you
know, certainly we didn‟t go out PUAing, but, I mean, like you said,
it‟s not dragon slaying. I can definitely how you get laid, it‟s enough
for me to believe. Your method, you know, I‟ve been studying for
many, many years, and am considered one of the advanced guys, and
your method‟s helped me, so…I mean, there are things about it that,
you know, I read and said “That makes sense”. You know, like we
were talking about it, whether or not you ever do, I don‟t care, man, I
mean, things you wrote were helpful to me and obviously helpful to
other guys, you know and so.
GUNWITCH: Like I always say, anyone who doesn‟t believe that I get
laid, doesn‟t get laid themselves. Or they‟d realize it‟s that fucking
FS101: Conversely.
GUNWITCH: Goober.
(Laughter)
FS101: Going back to your book for a sec, there‟s a, you came up with
something, or heard, and maybe it‟s not real in history, but it‟s a very
interesting, this thing called “The Stalin Trick”.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, yeah, I‟m not sure if it‟s real or not. Some people
say it is some people say it isn‟t, “The Stalin Trick”, which is jerking
off until you almost cum and then not cumming, yeah, I do that
sometimes, you know, twice in the morning or something. It kinda
gets, it keeps me fired up, I noticed I lift more weight when I do it.
FS101: Really…
GUNWITCH: I mean, it could take a lot of discipline, a lot of guys try it,
and they just end up jerking off. Yeah, it takes a while.
FS101: You‟re talking about the will power part, you mean.
FS101: That‟s what you said in your book. I mean it‟s interesting
„cause it sets up your, again to use this term I‟ve been throwing
around a lot, but the biofeedback mechanism, you‟re body‟s been
telling you “Fuck, you are not accomplishing the prime directive,
mother fucker”.
FS101: “I‟m going to give you a little bit more testosterone, you know,
I‟m going to work with you here, go get the shit done. „Cause, uh,
we ain‟t got much more time here.”
FS101: So I mean, I think there was a lot of common wisdom on the site,
you know, and people posting, saying, just don‟t masturbate for a
long time and you‟ll have more motivation, but this is interesting that
specifically, you know, you get the frustration added in of, like, you
bring yourself to the brink and then stop, and then , “Fuuuck, man”.
FS101: You know, that‟s a fucking interesting thing because, you know,
where the internet can help us, like we said we‟ve gained this access
to all these, you know, all this knowledge about how to do well with
women and the things you said are that, but on the other hand, it‟s
given the average guy the access to porn. Like massively. You
never have to walk outside your door to what you think is, you know,
satisfaction. That‟s a real big one.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, I mean I‟ve heard guys say they have, you know, in
GUNWITCH: No!
FS101: I‟ve actually found myself, you know, as much as I‟m able to get
chicks, there were times like, you know, I‟m out in some fucking
place in Taiwan doing a job and, you know, there‟s not a lot of chicks
around or whatever, and I‟ll get on the net and start just hitting one
of those free download things, and I‟ll catch myself, you know, I‟ll
have spent an hour doing some download on some chit, and I‟m like,
“All right, this is stupid”. I could go outside, and no matter how
many chicks aren‟t around, I‟ll find out. But I can just see how that
can be really addictive. It‟s funny, in a way, right now, that should
actually be a motivation to guys to realize that, hey, more and more
there‟s other guys who aren‟t going to be out on the market trying to
get chicks because they‟re doing that.
FS101: That‟s what I was going to say is one, you know, very concrete
that I used to use after having read your method and just realizing
how important being psyched up sexually is. Umm, what we‟re
recording this whole interview on is a Sony Clié. I was probably the
one who introduced this kind of thing to the community because they
were so popular in Japan, it was obviously 2, 3 years back, I‟ve been
using these kind of things, it‟s actually as long as 6 years I‟ve been
using these kind of personal digital assistants.
FS101: Yeah. But one of the cool things about this is you can load jpg‟s
onto it too, so, and little videos, and so, you know, the amount of any
porn I ever looked at, was I‟d have some pictures of, you know, the
chicks that were really hot and would get me fucking horny, and if
I‟m in a club or something, I‟d take a quick look at that, you know,
and boom, yeah, I‟d be that much more on with chicks, and, uh, so
there‟s an example of specifically how, you know, your writings
whether you‟ve ever got laid or not in your life, didn‟t matter, your
writings said something to me that I took and put into application,
and boom, I was getting more success with women.
GUNWITCH: Complacent.
FS101: This is always a difficult question, but I‟m doing, like, the
interview guy. What of, what single thing out of your method would
you choose and maybe say to guys this is the most important.
Would it be sexual state, would it be persistence, would it be internal
game…
FS101: Yup.
FS101: No, I like that. It every much jibes with, uh, my findings and
beliefs and put into practice. Umm, I‟d say, maybe we‟ll start
wrapping up the interview, but one thing I wanna do, and maybe it
should have been the first question. I guess I‟d like to simulate, you
know, one thing that, you know, guys are certainly able to get a lot
out of, you know, reading what you‟ve written and stuff, but you‟ve
said you‟ve coached a lot of guys in the field. And, you know, they
get really great results quickly, and I guess that‟s you kind of go over
Gunwitch Method with them verbally. Let‟s pretend right now I‟m
just an average, you know, and we‟re, maybe we‟re in front of a mall
or something. I‟d say, give me Gunwitch Method from your stand
FS101: Ah, yeah, another good point in your book, I like that. Don‟t
reject yourself.
GUNWITCH: Speak in the right ton and Eye Contact, yeah, and I‟ll
correct all that definitely first. And then I would watch what he‟s
doing verbally with her. And then once he get to a point where he
could get to a small rapport assumed, I would then I would just move
him on to more advanced stuff to like getting his inner game down.
That‟s why I‟m not big on doing any kind of seminars or anything,
that‟s the big thing with attraction phase, you need to get your inner
game down over time. You have to be able to project that
dominance, the masculinity, and you can‟t learn that in a couple
days.
FS101: That‟s what you‟re saying about your wing, he‟s a natural and
you don‟t, even though he‟s got access to one of the best seduction
artists in the world, you don‟t actually push it on him
FS101: So guys reading your book, though, maybe what do they need to
know to figure out what‟s wrong themselves?
FS101: I‟m with you on the, and probably one of the best things you can
do is lift weights.
FS101: You say people have had practice with that all their life.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, they know people, yeah. I find that topics can
really help that a lot because, like I was talking about, using stuff like
Simpsons or Seinfeld, TV shows are really popular. It‟s yeah, it‟s
like a shared experience. Like you notice with people in the
community, you get a rapport really fast, „cause you‟re talking about
this stuff, you got a common connection.
FS101: Exactly.
GUNWITCH: I mean, if me and you didn‟t know about this stuff and
didn‟t know that, shit, well we might end up talking about martial
arts and stuff because we both know about that.
FS101: Maybe, but. The level of rapport we have right now is a lot
higher than…
FS101: Stereotypes would be like, I‟m more the preppy guy and you‟re
GUNWITCH: I mean, it‟s the same with chicks, I mean you get a
rapport talking about Simpsons or something, I mean it‟s not going
to be this deep a level of rapport that quick, but there‟s attraction
with it. So that strengthens rapport better than just rapport can.
You‟ll never get a rapport like with someone who has a common
interest at all, but when somebody‟s attracted and you get the
rapport and attraction mix, it makes the rapport feel stronger than it
actually is, because there‟s the attraction there.
FS101: Yes.
FS101: Right, yeah, yeah. I do that a lot personally, I mean, I just act
like, I get the image in my mind of my, like, my last girlfriend and I‟m
acting like that the whole way through it…
FS101: Yeah, exactly. I feel very comfortable in that role with any
woman I‟ve met. I‟m already her boyfriend in my mind. I mean, I
FS101: „Cause that‟s where you‟re going, if you want to get physical with
her.
GUNWITCH: Yeah.
FS101: So, yeah, talk a little bit more about some of your advanced stuff,
you know, when you‟re getting to that level.
FS101: That‟s where you talk about their appearance and stuff, good
coaching in there, too.
FS101: Oh, right yeah, yeah, I like that one. That one was really
interesting.
GUNWITCH: Yeah. It‟s like, I‟ll just go up to the girl, I mean, she‟s
the hottest chick in the whole place. Everybody‟s looking at her, I
go up and I‟ll be like, I mean I totally lose my personality, “Oh my
friends over there say that you wouldn‟t dance with me”. Boom, the
chicks all over you, because they get that power rush, “Oh, he‟s such
a loser”, they‟re rubbing all over you. Every chick in the place‟s eye
on you, you start looking around.
GUNWITCH: Yeah, see which eyes are looking. Find them later. To
hell with the main chick, go get something else. Like I say, it‟s the
sex life, not about getting the one chick. Yeah, I want the chick I
want, not the chick that everybody wants. And you know, different
stuff like that‟s in Mastery. Advanced is probably the most
important, „cause that‟ s the thing that gets you beyond your looks or
your money or your standard attraction fodder. It gets you beyond
that and shows you how to get in their head and get a congruence
going with being a lover and how to be more masculine so they
match your state, things like that, and how to persist past duifferent
logistics. Things like that. Very important.
FS101: No, I liked specifically how you came up with that idea called
FS101: This whole, it‟s interesting that you said that adaptation is more
important than intelligence, and I never really specifically thought
FS101: That‟s what you‟re always saying in your book, practice, practice,
practice. Because of the internalization of it.
GUNWITCH: Yeah.
FS101: Well, cool, so I think we‟ve got about roughly got about 2 hours
here, let‟s check the old Sony Clié. Umm, yup, we‟re very close to 2
hours here, so I guess I‟ll give you chance to kinda wrap up for people.
Again, you know, for those who got in late or whatever, you know, we
finally put together something that for years people never thought
would happen.
GUNWITCH: Yeah.
FS101: Hopefully, this is a stepping stone, I mean, I think you said your
book started to become successful, and you have the financial
wherewithal to meet some more, and obviously that allows you to
continue evolving your own dynamic sex life
FS101: Yeah, this is the most unlikely of all venues I could have
imagined for having a meet with a famous guru.
FS101: Again, it‟s the information itself and not the place.
GUNWITCH: Yeah
FS101: So guys don‟t have to worry about that this was in Eugene,
Oregon, although those who want to someday see the, ah, scenic
Denny‟s on 3652 Glenwood Drive off of I5, sitting her in the parking
lot, you‟ll remember that this is where it all happened. All this
excellent information, which, hopefully…Again, we don‟t know what
format we‟ll ever get this out on, exactly, but I‟m going to use at least
some of this to, write up something which hopefully someday will
appear in a newsletter and maybe we‟ll make this available …Alright
man, well thanks again.
GUNWITCH: Yeah.
FS101: Make the ho say no, what a perfect way to end! Thanks
Gunwitch. Bye bye.
You've just been listening to the first-ever interview with Allen Reyes,
better known as “Gunwitch” in the pickup community. This audio
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